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What video should I select for this system in H-L?

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bent - 04 Jan 2007 02:49 GMT
I have some pretty decent hardware, at least it was, and I have tried to be
true to overclockability concepts.  So what video should I select when
playing H-L, b/c there are a few options, and I really don't know anywhere
near as much as I should about it.  I am new so iirc there's software,
DirectX, and OpenGL.  I am not even sure what I'm on, I think OpenGL.

Here's my stuff:

Asus P4C800E-D 2.6C@3.12 <oops> OCZ EL4200 512MB@DDR480 2.5-3-4-6 Zalman
CNPS-7000Cu, MCH, & Vantec Stealth Vantec Nexus NXP-305-BK fan & light
ctrlr. inverted blowhole panel Enermax EGP465P-VE S^2 FC^2 whisper LG
GSA-H10N WD7200.7 80GB PATA
2x 36GB Raptors Viewsonic P95f+B MSI FX5900XT-VTD128 @465/825 SBLive5.1
Logitec / IBM USR 2976 Motorola Surfboard

DirectX 9.0C

WinXP Pro
Lief - 04 Jan 2007 02:55 GMT
> I have some pretty decent hardware, at least it was, and I have tried to be
> true to overclockability concepts.  So what video should I select when
> playing H-L, b/c there are a few options, and I really don't know anywhere
> near as much as I should about it.  I am new so iirc there's software,
> DirectX, and OpenGL.  I am not even sure what I'm on, I think OpenGL.

OpenGL worked best and looked the best, for me.

> Here's my stuff:
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> 2x 36GB Raptors Viewsonic P95f+B MSI FX5900XT-VTD128 @465/825 SBLive5.1
> Logitec / IBM USR 2976 Motorola Surfboard

Ack, a  horrible way to list ya system....all those letters and numbers oO

Yes I'm bored this is how I list mine:

Asus av8 deluxe
AMD 3800+
1gb ddr ram
GF 7800GS 256mb
80gb HDD
Win2k SP2
bent - 04 Jan 2007 03:03 GMT
I knew to type in dxdiag, but not sure how to check OpenGL for anything.
I've got Sandra 2004, and 3DMark2001SE installed if I need some info for a
better description.
rms - 04 Jan 2007 15:11 GMT
I'd say a 7800-class card, or the ati equiv, right around $200.  You also
need another 512mb minimum.  If you can sell the whole system and get a
pci-e one with a 8800gs and a dual-core cpu that would let you play these
newest games.

rms
bent - 04 Jan 2007 17:44 GMT
but why not two 8800gss?
Lief - 04 Jan 2007 18:12 GMT
> but why not two 8800gss?

Sli is pretty much a waste of cash imo, considering how quickly graphics
cards get updated these days.
bent - 05 Jan 2007 03:42 GMT
In all truth I would be interested in knowing what, RAM and vid cards
especially, should be used to make the new HL2 EO playable, and to get all
the eye candy too.  Or at least preserve my dignity, like at least 1028x,
etc, notin' gone. I have seen the official requirements.  This is not a
boast, I'd really like to hear what you have to say about what is what.  I'm
only playin' 1009.

The vid card I have finshed Doom3, and is 2/3 through Farcry at mostly high
& @ 1028 or 1280, can't remember.   I have to wring it out upside down to do
it, but its fine to play with.  Same gpu batch as 5900 and 5950Ultra.  Not
quite as new, but it overclocks very well too.

A quote (last page of review), and the link (a common, but not HL spec):

"At stock speeds the MSI FX5900XT-VTD128 is a solid performer, often running
just shy of the ATi Radeon 9800 Pro in almost all the benchmarks. I
suspected the card would have some pretty good overclocking potential and it
did prove itself; with stock cooling we were able to push this bad boy up to
an amazing 508 MHz core, 809 MHz memory. At that speed, the card would
constantly battled it out with the ATi Radeon 9800XT and the MSI FX5950
Ultra-VTD256 for top spot overall!".

http://www.pcstats.com/articleview.cfm?articleid=1543&page=4

My single cpu is at 3.12GHz, and my 512 ram can do DDR576, DDR566 guaranteed
at enhanced latency.  Raptors help.
bent - 05 Jan 2007 03:44 GMT
its AGP8x, on the best 1 cpu mobo mcb.
McG. - 09 Jan 2007 12:31 GMT
You can't run an 840D Extreme?   Running Intel, you're CPU bound.
McG.

> its AGP8x, on the best 1 cpu mobo mcb.
>
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
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> =----
Lief - 05 Jan 2007 04:40 GMT
> In all truth I would be interested in knowing what, RAM and vid cards
> especially, should be used to make the new HL2 EO playable, and to get all
> the eye candy too.

Same gpu batch as 5900 and 5950Ultra.  Not
> quite as new, but it overclocks very well too.

> "At stock speeds the MSI FX5900XT-VTD128 is a solid performer,

> My single cpu is at 3.12GHz, and my 512 ram can do DDR576, DDR566 guaranteed
> at enhanced latency.  Raptors help.

Snipped some from above.

These days, for gaming, 1GB of ram is a minimum imo, I'm about to upgrade to
2gb as swap file thrashing sucks, I'll likely go up to 4gb to further
eliminate the need for a swap file, HDD have, for a long time, been the main
bottleneck in any pc, but I do tend to play memory intensive games.

I just upgraded my VGA card, from a GF5900 128mb to a GF7800GS 256mb, in
oblivion, the autodetect changed me from a low to a ultra high, though it
was wrong and it runs better one setting down.

The VGA card I currentley have is considered, from what I can gather to be
the best AGP card available at the moment, though pound for pound you'll get
a  better pci-e card for less.

Your cpu is fine really, an upgrade there wont hurt but I reckon you'll get
better performance by just upgrading your memory to 1gb, and upgrading to
the best VGA card you can afford.

If you have the cash, a new pci-e mobo would definitley give you the best
'future proofing' but I did that with my last system, and the one before
that, in my experience, future proofing just doesnt work.

Also the kind of games I play tend to be long runners, not week long
affairs, so constant upgrading isn't essential for me, I'll upgrade once
every 2-3 years.

Put simply, for around £250 you can have a system improved by around 80%,
for around £600 you can have a new system that'll 'last' longer.
bent - 05 Jan 2007 05:23 GMT
Heres a site I use to look up things because they prob have whats best.
They may have higher prices.  I'm betting higher prices means better.  The
card you mentioned seems to be lower priced in th ePCI-E version than the
AGP.  I am out of date.  I'm gonna go to wikipedia to learn a bit before I
come back

http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=Big
foot&Category_Code=950.2

bent - 05 Jan 2007 05:46 GMT
heres something to consider:
http://www.legitreviews.com/article/415/1/

I don't know why they haven't got dual 16MB cache RAID0 Raptors in there!?
bent - 05 Jan 2007 06:11 GMT
can anyone tell me why I see 1.6GHz (DDR3) listed in some of these vid cards
at $575 e.g.
http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=8
218&Category_Code=950.2
,

but  ONLY 900MHz for the 8800GTX, around
$800(http://www.nvidia.com/page/geforce_8800.html,)

while still other cards have 1360MHZ, for little over $325
(http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=8
212&Category_Code=950.2
)

isn't 1.6GHz better than 900MHz; but wouldn't it be in there if it made any
difference?
bent - 05 Jan 2007 17:41 GMT
come on, this is good stuff
bent - 05 Jan 2007 18:03 GMT
I had my 5900XT for some time before I even tried to get it functioning at
max, and it wasn't too long ago (6 mos) that I saw people posting "older"
cards at memory somewhat greater than 1 GHz, meaning So now 1.6Ghz, though
surprising, is no surprise.  MY 5900XT operates easily over 815Mhz, some
5900XTs at 1000Mhz or greater.  So what IS a surprise is that the 8800GTX is
900.  Heh (just thought this), should I multiply this by 2 to be comparing
apples with apples? i.e is it really 1.8GHz?
bent - 05 Jan 2007 18:08 GMT
or is that apple-orange in a bannanna kind of way?  care to share
rms - 07 Jan 2007 05:42 GMT
the 8800 has a very wide memory buswidth, and I'm sure the stream processing
architecture also affects the effective bandwith.  Anandtech etc have
articles on it's architecture you can read.

rms
McG. - 09 Jan 2007 12:42 GMT
>I had my 5900XT for some time before I even tried to get it functioning
>at max, and it wasn't too long ago (6 mos) that I saw people posting
[quoted text clipped - 3 lines]
>is that the 8800GTX is 900.  Heh (just thought this), should I multiply
>this by 2 to be comparing apples with apples? i.e is it really 1.8GHz?

http://users.erols.com/chare/video.htm
Check out all the GPU chipsets, then read all the stuff at the bottom of
the page.
McG.

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McG. - 09 Jan 2007 12:40 GMT
> can anyone tell me why I see 1.6GHz (DDR3) listed in some of these vid
> cards at $575 e.g.
> http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=8
218&Category_Code=950.2
,
>
> but  ONLY 900MHz for the 8800GTX, around
> $800(http://www.nvidia.com/page/geforce_8800.html,)

It's ddr, 900 is the actual clock for 1800 DDR
McG.

> while still other cards have 1360MHZ, for little over $325
> (http://www.bigfootcomputers.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=8
212&Category_Code=950.2
)
>
> isn't 1.6GHz better than 900MHz; but wouldn't it be in there if it
> made any difference?

1600 mHz is the stock "base" memory clock for an 8800.   I see a few
with 2000 mHz clocks.
McG.

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McG. - 09 Jan 2007 12:37 GMT
> heres something to consider:
> http://www.legitreviews.com/article/415/1/
>
> I don't know why they haven't got dual 16MB cache RAID0 Raptors in
> there!?

They get hot.  No need for that.

You will do FAR better with 2 gigs of ram over even touching a HD for
performance.   All this speed talk about hd's is foolish.   HD's are for
long term storage.  If you're actively caching running stuff on any hd,
you're shooting yourself in the foot, speedwise.  2 gigs of dual channel
ram is *good* for todays games.
McG.

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> News==----
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> 120,000+ Newsgroups
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bent - 13 Jan 2007 19:03 GMT
I undastand what ur saying, but they are significantly faster in everything,
and for a little extra, you got to be kidding!  Its not the cache, its da
access and transfer, and in RAID0, forgeddaboutit.
McG. - 09 Jan 2007 12:30 GMT
> In all truth I would be interested in knowing what, RAM and vid cards
> especially, should be used to make the new HL2 EO playable, and to get
[quoted text clipped - 24 lines]
> My single cpu is at 3.12GHz, and my 512 ram can do DDR576, DDR566
> guaranteed at enhanced latency.  Raptors help.

AMD A64 X2 4800+
Gigabyte GA K8N SLI
2 gigs PC3200 in dual channel
2 eVGA 7800GTX 256 meg ACS3 (SLI)
3 160g IDE ATA100 hd's
1 NEC double side DVD RW
XP Pro x64 & 32 bit
Onboard RealTek AC97  8 channel sound
Altec-Lansing 45s  (2 sat 1 sub woofer, old but *GOOD*!)
2 Samsung 204B  20.1" and 1 Samsung 930B 19" LCD flatpanel monitors.
Antec 550W ATX12V 2.1  dual +12v rails
All fans are 120mm 2000 rpm (except the vid cards stock cooling)

This X2 cpu was a year old in November.  This is the second mobo I've
had it in.  The first was AGP, this one is PCI-express x16.  Best damn
rig I've ever built, for everything.   Imaging, Photography, 3D progs,
Games.
I don't even need to run in SLI for playing FEAR at 1600x1200 with most
everything on and get 40+ framerates.  HL2 maxed out, everything,
1600x1200, framerates about 70ish. in single display acceleration but
NOT in SLI.    SLI isn't needed, really, so far :)  But it's avaialable,
and it adds about 30% MORE performance (speed) to full tilt FEAR, Far
Cry and HL2DM in 1600x1200.
Don't forget, these games are running in 64bits too.

*NOTHING* is OC'd.   This rig is fast and quiet.  Under full load
gaming, the CPU hits 43C, fan is at 3200.   That's just barely got it
warmed up good.

Your raptors do not help nearly as much as a full 2 gigs of even DDR400
would.  A 7800GS (AGP) would help you out some more.   A dual core
Extreme CPU would also be good.  But you'd have to change mobos, psu and
ram to use that.

My PNY FX5900-128 meg runs neck and neck with my Ati Radeon 9800 Pro
128.  WHAT is all this big hype about an ATI 9800 Pro?!?!?!   These are
both venerable but OLD cards, early stock.   The FX5900 is a lot more
stable under full 3D games loading than the 9800 Pro.  But they are both
very slow compared to a 6800GT even.  I think you can even get a 7900GS
for your AGP mobo.

All those 'system stats' don't mean a damn thing.   What matters is what
the games behave like.  If the games you play are fast and *smooth*, you
have quick response with silky smooth gameplay... THAT is the one stat
that matters.
Well, unless the "OC Clique" *IS* your game.

It was about this time a year ago that I finished building the current
iteration of my X2 rig.   I've been doing the build thing for many
years.   I've gone the OC route, I've burned out CPU's, ram, mobos, vid
cards, psu's learnig how it all works from the early days.   I
deliberately chose a different route this time.  I wanted and planned
out a fast, cool and quiet system.   I have that now.  It frikkin WORKS
:)  I still have a couple case tweaks to do for airflow.  Been lazy
about it.   With no OC'ing, this is still even now one of the baddest
game boxes around.
McG.
Ben Cottrell - 04 Jan 2007 15:51 GMT
> I have some pretty decent hardware, at least it was, and I have tried to be
> true to overclockability concepts.  So what video should I select when
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
> 2x 36GB Raptors Viewsonic P95f+B MSI FX5900XT-VTD128 @465/825 SBLive5.1
> Logitec / IBM USR 2976 Motorola Surfboard

Given that Half-Life is going to be 10 years old next year, your system
spec is way beyond what anyone could have ever dreamed of back in 1998
when the game was released :-)

If you're using OpenGL mode, stick with it.  DirectX mode has always
been slower and buggy in my experience.  Software mode is less buggy,
but generally runs far slower, and looks quite ugly too (But some people
report that using software mode in elevators stops them sticking to the
floor/wall)

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Ben Cottrell AKA Bench

 
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