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Game Forum / Action Games / Half Life / January 200527014 gamers can't be wrong about steam!
27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! so please join us and sign-in at: "Say NO! to Steam!" petition available at petitiononline: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam top 10 things to know before buying half-life 2 and accepting steam http://www.talkaboutcomputing.com/group/comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action/messages/69 3411.html > 27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! > so please join us and sign-in at: > "Say NO! to Steam!" I wouldn't want to be there when Walter catches up with you. >> 27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >> so please join us and sign-in at: >> "Say NO! to Steam!" I guess the rest of the 50.000 been banned by Valve thinks it's ok to be banned Hmm who would have thought that - Peter On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 08:04:44 +0000, during a voyage through the cold waters of comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action, i happened upon the crew of difool <john.difool@mail.telepac.pt>: >27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >so please join us and sign-in at: >"Say NO! to Steam!" >petition available at petitiononline: >http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html It's good to see those opposed to STEAM gather their signatures in one place even if those who feel they have something to contribute is nothing more than "f.ck steam! gabe is gay!!1" Oh well. Thanks for the link. -- best regards, mat np: wipers - no solution www.pdxshows.net Vader des Vaderlands bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, white hot flames, and screamed... >On Mon, 10 Jan 2005 08:04:44 +0000, during a voyage through the cold >waters of comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action, i happened upon the crew of [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] >nothing more than "f.ck steam! gabe is gay!!1" Oh well. Thanks for >the link. who the hell is gabe? -- Zag Guns cause crime like flies cause garbage ...bumper sticker >Vader des Vaderlands bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, >white hot flames, and screamed... [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > >who the hell is gabe? GAbe somethiing or other is the lead deisgner and possibly CEO of Valve. Lynley >>Vader des Vaderlands bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, >>white hot flames, and screamed... [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > GAbe somethiing or other is the lead deisgner and possibly CEO of > Valve. Yep. all the information you never wanted to know about Valve workers ;) http://www.valvesoftware.com/people.php  SignatureBen Cottrell AKA Bench Ben Cottrell bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, white hot flames, and screamed... >>>Vader des Vaderlands bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, >>>white hot flames, and screamed... [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >Yep. all the information you never wanted to know about Valve workers ;) >http://www.valvesoftware.com/people.php I've already got all the information I need. :^) Now I must go on with my one-man crusade to drive Valve out of business. You never realize how easy it is to not spend money until you try it. A crusade of keeping my money in my pocket for more important things. Why didn't I think of this before? -- Zag Guns cause crime like flies cause garbage ...bumper sticker > It's good to see those opposed to STEAM gather their signatures in one > place even if those who feel they have something to contribute is > nothing more than "f.ck steam! gabe is gay!!1" Oh well. Thanks for > the link. you probably read only one post of mine where i was vocal against steam and ignored all the rest, that's ok... but i'm no hypocrite, the first one its what i feel cause valve did the same to me valve "f"ed gamers like myself, so shouldn't i have reasons to "f" them back? yes i have! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html On Tue, 11 Jan 2005 08:50:12 +0000, during a voyage through the cold waters of comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action, i happened upon the crew of difool <john.difool@mail.telepac.pt>: >> It's good to see those opposed to STEAM gather their signatures in one >> place even if those who feel they have something to contribute is [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >valve "f"ed gamers like myself, so shouldn't i have reasons to "f" them >back? yes i have! Sure when a product causes trouble and flat out refuses to work on some machines people have a right to complain until either it is fixed or a recall is initiated. I was just bemoaning some of the signatures on the petition and not anything in particular that you had said. March on! -- best regards, mat np: wipers - no solution www.pdxshows.net > Sure when a product causes trouble and flat out refuses to work on > some machines people have a right to complain until either it is fixed again, i don't think you are seeing clearly valve with steam put aside gamers without internet connection period this is not "product causes trouble", this is a product which valve decided could not function with a particular group of gamers but is there REAL reasons for internet required in single-player hl2? NO! there isn't!!! to REALLY play hl2 you need a p4, lots of ram and a hardware graphic accelerator, but NOT INTERNET ACCESS!!! so valve decided to completely neglect a group of gamers only so they can apply a plan to simply give them more power and make them more money do they have the right? off course they have! do WE the gamers who have been put aside have the right to flame valve? off course WE have! f* valve a million times its what i say! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html >> Sure when a product causes trouble and flat out refuses to work on >> some machines people have a right to complain until either it is [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] > valve? off course WE have! > f* valve a million times its what i say! yeah and you've told us that about a million times SignatureYou're not a God, you're a birthday cake! or what about a program that installs spyware in your computer? Maybe it's not spyware, but to me, any program that installs something in my computer that runs at startup and connects to the internet without my consent is spyware. > or what about a program that installs spyware in your computer? Maybe > it's not spyware, but to me, any program that installs something in my > computer that runs at startup and connects to the internet without my > consent is spyware. I presume you are referring to Steam? It does neither of those things. Signature"valve = worshiping satan (this one is only speculation but probably true)" Difool in comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action > or what about a program that installs spyware in your computer? Maybe > it's not spyware, but to me, any program that installs something in my > computer that runs at startup and connects to the internet without my > consent is spyware. I don't think that's quite the definition used by most people. http://www.google.com/search?num=20&hl=en&lr=lang_en&c2coff=1&oi=defmore&q=defin e:Spyware I'm not sure what you would call the above conditions that you laid out? > or what about a program that installs spyware in your computer? Maybe > it's not spyware, but to me, any program that installs something in my > computer that runs at startup and connects to the internet without my > consent is spyware. Not even close to spyware. Also, there is an option in Steam to disable the autostartup. I was slightly annoyed by that myself, but I just turned it off. Since I have a broadband internet connection, I'm not really concerned about Steam overall. It is a unique idea that helps to eliminate piracy and ensure that those playing the game own the game. That said, I can understand that there are still gameer without internet connections who will find that they buy the game and then can't play it at all. They certainly have a right to be upset, especially if they purchase the game from a store that doesn't allow returns of opened software. My only real concern about Steam is ... what happens several years down the line if Valve goes the way of Sir-Tech, Looking Glass, etc, and goes under. If the company goes, so does Steam... and then no one who purchased any of the games requiring a Steam login will be able to play those games. Hopefully, that won't ever be an issue, but it is a question to ponder. > 27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! Idunno. Steam makes for some mighty tasty broccoli, and it's such an effective natural moisturizer, too. >27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! Taking a quick look at the comments, yeah, they can. >27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >so please join us and sign-in at: >"Say NO! to Steam!" >petition available at petitiononline: >http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html Heck, and I haven't even signed it. I don't believe in petitions, I believe in informing the public. >> 27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >> so please join us and sign-in at: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > I don't believe in petitions, I believe in informing the public. everything is important when it comes to fight steam valve's has many powerfull weapons, so we must use everything we have! come on Riku! sign-in man! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html >27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >so please join us and sign-in at: >"Say NO! to Steam!" >petition available at petitiononline: >http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html ...nor will I sign it, because I think the message and argument in that petition is rather weak. I have pointed out my reasons why I don't like Steam for single-player games. What is the purpose of that petition anyway? What are you asking Valve to do, to close down Steam? Or is that petition just a general "Shame on you, we hate you!" directed to Valve? A good petition would tell what the signers want Valve to do, for example: 1. Make it possible to freely transfer individual Steam games between accounts, and maybe also to freely unregister the CD key of the CD/DVD version, in order to make it easier/possible to transfer the ownership of individual Steam games, and generally make it easier to administer one's Steam accounts, if someone has several of them (e.g. different accounts for the different members of the family with their own choice of games). This does not necessarily have to apply to banned or locked Steam accounts. 2. Drop the online validation requirement for the single-player game of the RETAIL (CD/DVD) version so that people who rather want to buy a stand-alone version of a Steam game can buy one. Use other more commonly used ways to protect your copyright on the retail CD/DVD version, like DVD checks. People who hate DVD checks can buy the non-physical Steam-only version with its online validation etc. More choices to the customer = good. 3. Release Steam game updates also separately so that people can download and archive them and update their Steam games manually with the update of their choice, if they so wish. Just like they can do with all their other PC games. So doesn't this sound more useful petition? At least Valve could react to its points and give their answers why they possibly disagree with these points. At least it could be funny to hear their excuses. It is like that one anti-piracy lawyer claiming that the only home-users who want and need a broadband internet connection are pirates, others are fine with a dialup connection for their web browsing and emails. ;-) Well said Riku. My son has just brought HL1 and HL2. Although he will occasionally play a MP game, in reality he simply doesn't have the time so he really ONLY needs the single-player, OFFLINE mode. At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open a steam A/C (and only because I'm being FORCED to). -- Barry... > Well said Riku. > > My son has just brought HL1 and HL2. Although he will occasionally > play a MP game, in reality he simply doesn't have the time so he really > ONLY needs the single-player, OFFLINE mode. Why does playing MP take any more time than playing SP? > At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is > SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open > a steam A/C (and only because I'm being FORCED to). Yes. To validate your legitimate purchase. > -- > Barry... SignatureWalter Mitty - Useless, waste of money research of the day : http://tinyurl.com/6yh2f http://www.tinyurl.com >> At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is >> SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open >> a steam A/C (and only because I'm being FORCED to). > >Yes. To validate your legitimate purchase. Are you claiming other PC CD/DVD games (with no online activation) don't validate your legitimate purchase at all? "Walter Mitty" <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in part... > Why does playing MP take any more time than playing SP? Simply that he can save a SP game and restart from that save point. I presume that can't be done in a MP game. > Yes. To validate your legitimate purchase. There are many other ways to validate my legitimate purchase. The point is Valve could make HL2 in various versions, ie. online/MP only, offline/SP only, both, etc. Although millions have access to the internet around the world, that's actually a very small percentage of the total world population. Significantly fewer people have access to broad band. Anyway, *I* prefer to just have a offline/SP version and I don't want to have to install some other software simply to play the game that I or my son has legally purchased. I presume that you "like" steam. That's fine by me, but I don't. I'll install it, tolerate it, but only because I have NO choice and that is the real issue here ... NO choice. Barry... > "Walter Mitty" <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in part... > >>Why does playing MP take any more time than playing SP? > > Simply that he can save a SP game and restart from that save point. > I presume that can't be done in a MP game. Erm. *boggle*. >>Yes. To validate your legitimate purchase. > > There are many other ways to validate my legitimate purchase. > > The point is Valve could make HL2 in various versions, ie. > online/MP only, offline/SP only, both, etc. They have. > Although millions have access to the internet around the world, that's > actually a very small percentage of the total world population. True. But most with computers do. If not, well ... > Significantly fewer people have access to broad band. True, but Ive read many posts from people with 56k modems who also had no problem. > Anyway, *I* prefer to just have a offline/SP version and I don't want > to have to install some other software simply to play the game that I or > my son has legally purchased. What other SW? Do you feel the same way about most games using directx to support them? > I presume that you "like" steam. That's fine by me, but I don't. I'll > install it, tolerate it, but only because I have NO choice and that is the > real issue here ... NO choice. Sure you have a choice : dont buy it. "Walter Mitty" <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in part... > > Simply that he can save a SP game and restart from that save point. > > I presume that can't be done in a MP game. > > Erm. *boggle*. What does that mean? Yes or No? Speak, err, write english. > > There are many other ways to validate my legitimate purchase. > > > > The point is Valve could make HL2 in various versions, ie. > > online/MP only, offline/SP only, both, etc. > > They have. Where are they then? The only ones I've seen REQUIRE a internet connection to validate my purchase and open a steam A/C. That is *NOT* a offline or SP ONLY version of HL2. > > I presume that you "like" steam. That's fine by me, but I don't. I'll > > install it, tolerate it, but only because I have NO choice and that is the > > real issue here ... NO choice. > > Sure you have a choice : don't buy it. That is just ONE choice and the ONLY choice I have. Valve could have easily created other "choices" but choose not to. Here's another objection ... their FORCED updates to the game. As I understand it, if you don't update, you can't play. Not even in offline mode. Correct me if I'm wrong. How does Valve know that the update isn't going to break HL2 on *my* PC? Or worse, "break" something in Windows that stops the PC from working. They don't and can never know that. This is a family used for more than just playing games. OK, there's an update to HL2. Tell me about it and let me install it when I'm ready and in a somewhat controlled environment. But don't stop me from playing HL2 in the mean time. That's being autocratic and arrogant in the extreme. If you tell me that the updates don't go wrong, then I would say you have simply been lucky so far. Recently I tried to install the latest Intel network drivers and the install completely stuffed things up. I lost all network connection. Fortunately I had a Ghost image backup of my C_Drive and a simply restore resolved the issue. Over the years, heaps of updates have gone "bad" for whatever reason. I DON'T install new software and/or updates on this PC, excluding virus sig updates and similar during the week. I only install updates, etc. at the W/E after taking a image backup of my C_Drive. Now if my son comes home from school on, say, Tuesday and there's a HL2 update then unless it's installed then, he can't play HL2 for the rest of the week. As I said, bloody arrogant. Anyway, I'm arguing with a Steam apologist and there is nothing that I can say that will change your opinion. That's your right. To put it simply we agree to disagree. Barry... "Walter Mitty" <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in part... > Bazza wrote: > Here's another objection ... their FORCED updates to the game. As I > understand it, if you don't update, you can't play. Not even in offline > mode. Correct me if I'm wrong. From what I've read here, and from my memory of the steam settings page (not in front of my home computer at the moment, so can't check) there is an option to disable automatic updates of the games. > Or worse, "break" something in Windows that stops the PC from > working. They don't and can never know that. I suspect they can be reasonably certain of it. If HL2 is like most games it will be pretty self contained, apart from directx interaction and the like, and a patch would only alter files in the HL2 directory. Short of causing your machine to run out of disk space I'd say it's fairly safe. Updates to steam itself I'd be less sure of, but would still expect to be self contained. > Tell me about it and let me install it when I'm ready Now that I can fully agree with, though more from the perspective riku has described, of being able to choose which patch you'd like to play. > Recently I tried to install the latest Intel network > drivers and the install completely stuffed things up. I lost all network > connection. Not a good comparison. First of all, installing drivers can easilly cause all manner of problems. A network driver is used by all sorts of apparently unrelated processes, so it can cause all manner of seemingly random crashes. Furthermore, having a new network driver directly affect your machine's networking is far more understable than having a game update affect anything other than the game. > Anyway, I'm arguing with a Steam apologist and there is nothing that I can > say that will change your opinion. Well, I hope that you, or any of the other people I've commented to, don't regard me as a steam apologist. I do think the system has potential, but is not without the need for improvement. I was initially very put off by the thought of having to install it, but have since changed my mind somewhat. >"Bazza" <Bazza@privacy.com> wrote in message news:34kq71F4d1f7fU1@individual.net... >>"Walter Mitty" <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in part... >> > There are many other ways to validate my legitimate purchase. [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >connection to validate my purchase and open a steam A/C. That is >*NOT* a offline or SP ONLY version of HL2. The above is a *shining* example of the kind of half truths that Walter perpetually spits out regarding steam. Another favorite was that "HL2 does not require an internet connect". He said that about a week after it came out, and was called on it. I believe he said something like "you don't need internet to play it in single player or offline", playing semantic word games. You definately need the connection to validate and *start* playing though. So his statement was blatantly false, and probably deliberate. I'm glad Walter is continuing to show everyone how deleriously devoted he is on this subject. He just keeps spinning and telling half-truths and refusing to accept *any* complaints regarding steam, on any level. Even to the point that he'll tell baldface lies to make his point. >> > I presume that you "like" steam. That's fine by me, but I don't. I'll >> > install it, tolerate it, but only because I have NO choice and that is the [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >That is just ONE choice and the ONLY choice I have. Valve could have >easily created other "choices" but choose not to. I agree. The single player version could have just been like any other game. CD check and go. They really did think that they would stop people from pirating with steam, but it didn't. It actually had the opposite effect, making it easier. As I keep pointing out, the 50k people who got it for free off Valve's own servers by exploiting a security loophole. And if you look at this site: http://cs.rin.ru/forum/viewforum.php?f=10&sid=9759ef9d0b60cfdad5d11999f92c0b76 You'll see that people are *still* able to do so! It's stunning, that Steam is so incredibly insecure. Then again, this is the company that let their source code get stolen. And yet Walter defends steam as this great and wonderful thing when it's such a piece of garbage that's full of security loopholes. He just calls it lies and keeps his head in the sand. He's the one who keeps lying and is wildly misinformed. Wildly misinformed Walter. Get out and see the rest of the world, not just the little corner of it you live in. >Here's another objection ... their FORCED updates to the game. As I >understand it, if you don't update, you can't play. Not even in offline >mode. Correct me if I'm wrong. No, that is not true. Once you are enabled for offline mode it keeps working fine. At least mine does. On more than one occasion I have been playing in offline mode after a patch was released. If you think about it, how would it even know if there is a patch if it's offline? :) But it does seem to force the patches on you when you log in. I've read on the Steam forums from people who are trying to keep their game from updating because they feel that problems like the stutter bug get worse with each patch, and after massive tweaking and configuring they got it smooth, and don't want to get another patch. And so they put it on "Never update this game". And yet, it still does. The above is not my claim. I am just repeating what I read, it may or may not be true. I'm willing to accept I may be wrong on that. But if it's true, that's pretty stupid too. Why even have the option of whether to accept patches or not when they are forced on you? >Anyway, I'm arguing with a Steam apologist and there is nothing that I can >say that will change your opinion. That's your right. >To put it simply we agree to disagree. He's more than a steam apologist. He's a liar and incapable of realizing he is wrong on any level. He's one of those people that will continue to argue long after they have been beaten, just because they are in such denial and so full of themselves that they cannot possibly give in. His point above about how "they have" (made other versions of the game) is a shining example. That's a blatant lie, or at the very least, trying to pass off a half-truth as a fact. I had a roomate like him once. So annoying. Never ever wrong about anything, ever. You'd have him completely cornered and ask some totally ridiculous question that just shows how stupid his point of view was, and yet he would still say "yes" or "no" to the question, whichever kept his point of view alive. It was so stupifying I often had no clue what to say next. What do you say when someone is sitting in deliberate denial and just arguing becuase they are determined to never be beaten? Nothing. You just let them live with their heads in the sand. I suggest filtering Walter. He's never going to be reasoned with. >>"Bazza" <Bazza@privacy.com> wrote in message > [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > was that "HL2 does not require an internet connect". He said > that about a week after it came out, and was called on it. I This is complete rubbish : I said you dont need a connection to play. If, for once, I neglected to concur that it needed a connection to validate then thats a different story - I apologise. However, Valve support themselves have described how one may install HL2 on a PC with no connection. > believe he said something like "you don't need internet to play > it in single player or offline", playing semantic word games. > You definately need the connection to validate and *start* > playing though. So his statement was blatantly false, and > probably deliberate. You're, as usual, changing the prioirity of my words. This makes you look stupider than I ever could. > I'm glad Walter is continuing to show everyone how deleriously > devoted he is on this subject. He just keeps spinning and telling > half-truths and refusing to accept *any* complaints regarding > steam, on any level. Even to the point that he'll tell baldface > lies to make his point. More blatant lies. I recognise difficulties and have helped many people get over their issues : generally issues with restarting steam ... >>>>I presume that you "like" steam. That's fine by me, but I don't. I'll >>>>install it, tolerate it, but only because I have NO choice and that is [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > that Steam is so incredibly insecure. Then again, this is the > company that let their source code get stolen. Whoopee doo. So, some SW had some bugs/loopholes. Nothing to see hear here folks, move along. > And yet Walter defends steam as this great and wonderful > thing when it's such a piece of garbage that's full of security > loopholes. He just calls it lies and keeps his head in the sand. > He's the one who keeps lying and is wildly misinformed. "so full of loopholes"??!?!?!?. f.ck me, you're a twat. Steam has discouraged casual copying : a good thing IMO. I have never called such things "lies" either. Sometimes FUD, when justified, yes. > Wildly misinformed Walter. Get out and see the rest of the > world, not just the little corner of it you live in. See other posts from many, many satisified customers. Maybe you're just to thick to get Steam to work : post your specs - I'll see if I can help ... oh wait, I see you do have it working. Oh look!!! In offline mode too. Well done. >>Here's another objection ... their FORCED updates to the game. As I >>understand it, if you don't update, you can't play. Not even in offline >>mode. Correct me if I'm wrong. > > No, that is not true. Once you are enabled for offline mode > it keeps working fine. At least mine does. On more than one And so many keep stating "you need a connection to PLAY the game". Blatant falsehood. > occasion I have been playing in offline mode after a patch was > released. If you think about it, how would it even know if there > is a patch if it's offline? :) > > But it does seem to force the patches on you when you log in. This is not so good. I would suggest that Valve will produce a rollback soon. > I've read on the Steam forums from people who are trying to > keep their game from updating because they feel that problems [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > That's a blatant lie, or at the very least, trying to pass off a > half-truth as a fact. Who are you raving about now? > I had a roomate like him once. So annoying. Never ever wrong > about anything, ever. You'd have him completely cornered and [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > you say when someone is sitting in deliberate denial and just > arguing becuase they are determined to never be beaten? Your ability to change the focus of a subject is becoming legendary. Your hiler than thou stand is not, however, convincing. You're a pompous prick with nothing substantial to back up your hatred of the steam system other than "what might be" in the future. I bow before your ability to gaze ahead into time. > Nothing. You just let them live with their heads in the sand. > > I suggest filtering Walter. He's never going to be reasoned > with. Not by a spammer like you anyway Jim. And just to reiterate : I have never had a problem with Steam : it installed and ran fine. It keeps my SW upto date. If I want I can run offline. If I want I can install the SW on anymachine with a net link without having to cart around scratch prone media like CD/DVD. SignatureWalter Mitty - Useless, waste of money research of the day : http://tinyurl.com/6yh2f http://www.tinyurl.com > > Anyway, *I* prefer to just have a offline/SP version and I don't want > > to have to install some other software simply to play the game that I or > > my son has legally purchased. > > What other SW? Do you feel the same way about most games using directx > to support them? DirectX is 99% of the time included with the game, and doesn't require you to have a (preferably) broadband Net connection to use it. Signature-- There is no spoon. EvilBill - http://www.evilbill.50megs.com/index.html My Quake2 FTP site: ftp://65.30.181.223/quake2/EvilBill/ Jack of Hearts of the Eeeevil Trek Cabal (TINC) >>>Anyway, *I* prefer to just have a offline/SP version and I don't want >>>to have to install some other software simply to play the game that I or [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > DirectX is 99% of the time included with the game, and doesn't require you > to have a (preferably) broadband Net connection to use it. What ever gave you the impressiont that you need a broadband connection to play HL2? Better : yes. Required : no. > > DirectX is 99% of the time included with the game, and doesn't require you > > to have a (preferably) broadband Net connection to use it. > > What ever gave you the impressiont that you need a broadband connection > to play HL2? Better : yes. Required : no. Well I don't know how big the download is for updating Steam and so forth, but considering that somewhere else in this thread it was referred to as 'bloatware', I think it might take some considerable time on dial-up. Since I'm on a Surftime ISP, I get disconnected automatically every two hours... Signature-- There is no spoon. EvilBill - http://www.evilbill.50megs.com/index.html My Quake2 FTP site: ftp://65.30.181.223/quake2/EvilBill/ Jack of Hearts of the Eeeevil Trek Cabal (TINC) >Well I don't know how big the download is for updating Steam and so forth, >but considering that somewhere else in this thread it was referred to as >'bloatware', I think it might take some considerable time on dial-up. Since >I'm on a Surftime ISP, I get disconnected automatically every two hours... That is another advantage of Steam, it will download what it needs in the background and takes disconnections in its stride. SignatureAndrew, contact via interpleb.blogspot.com Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards, please don't top post. Trim replies to quote only relevant text. Check groups.google.com before asking an obvious question. /snip/ Although millions have access to the internet around the world, that's actually a very small percentage of the total world population. Significantly fewer people have access to broad band. As is the number of the world population who have a computer or could spend that much money on a game. Think about what you are saying before you post. /snip/ > > At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is > > SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open > > a steam A/C (and only because I'm being FORCED to). > > Yes. To validate your legitimate purchase. If it is legit, why do I have to keep validating its legitimacy? Very weak, Walter. SignatureNiko Wellingk >>>At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is >>>SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > If it is legit, why do I have to keep validating its legitimacy? > Very weak, Walter. You don't. SignatureWalter Mitty - Useless, waste of money research of the day : http://tinyurl.com/6yh2f http://www.tinyurl.com >>>>At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is >>>>SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > >You don't. Ok then, how does validating stop thieves and piracy? Lynley >>>>>At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is >>>>>SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > > Lynley You dont have to keep validating. You can do it once. Whats so difficult to understand, and if youre on broadband flatrate, whats the problem : the game isnt being re-validated - steam checks for updates. SignatureWalter Mitty - Useless, waste of money research of the day : http://tinyurl.com/6yh2f http://www.tinyurl.com >>>>>>At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is >>>>>>SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >to understand, and if youre on broadband flatrate, whats the problem : >the game isnt being re-validated - steam checks for updates. You still haven't answered me. Pirates wil crack it so they will NEVER have to validate, all this feature of Steam does is inconvenience and annoy legitimate users just like most other copyprots. Lynley > You still haven't answered me. Pirates wil crack it so they will > NEVER have to validate, all this feature of Steam does is > inconvenience and annoy legitimate users just like most other > copyprots. AMEN. The problem is Walter thinks it actually is stopping pirates, when it's not. That's the foundation of his entire world view on this, so he's not going to let it go. His entire argument collapses in seconds once he admits that it didn't do jack squat to stop pirates. He keeps saying it did, but people are *still* downloading it through Steam illegitimately, and there are tons of cracks and emulators out there. And it was out on the net, working, within 2 days max. It was out earlier than that, but it was a bit goofed up at first, with hud problems, and the AI would stop working. But people fixed that in a matter of one day. (again, for those that don't read every message, I do NOT pirate this sh.t. I know people who do. At least 5 people I work with are warez junkies, and so are a couple of relatives. I don't just sit in a dream world and make up lies and half truths about steam, I post based on *facts*). >>You still haven't answered me. Pirates wil crack it so they will >>NEVER have to validate, all this feature of Steam does is [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > it's not. That's the foundation of his entire world view on this, > so he's not going to let it go. His entire argument collapses in I have never said Steam stops pirating. Ever. I have said (again) that it doscourages casual copying. It also goes a long way to provide automatic update support for computer illiterates, and to discourage/detect cheats in MP environments. > seconds once he admits that it didn't do jack squat to stop > pirates. He keeps saying it did, but people are *still* downloading [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > up at first, with hud problems, and the AI would stop working. > But people fixed that in a matter of one day. So? Steam is not the next coming. No SW is crack proof. You yourself were so illuminating on this subject ensuring we knew that you knew about dissassembly and rerouting validation SW. > (again, for those that don't read every message, I do NOT pirate > this sh.t. I know people who do. At least 5 people I work with > are warez junkies, and so are a couple of relatives. I don't just > sit in a dream world and make up lies and half truths about steam, > I post based on *facts*). Can you quote *anyone* who has said that Steam can not be cracked? Walter Mitty <mitticus@yahoo.co.uk> looked up from reading the entrails of the porn spammer to utter "The Augury is good, the signs say: >>>You still haven't answered me. Pirates wil crack it so they will >>>NEVER have to validate, all this feature of Steam does is [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >I have never said Steam stops pirating. Ever. I have said (again) that >it doscourages casual copying. How? If little Johnny could burn little Jerry a copy of the cds before, why can't he now? If little Johnny can call in, validate and set into offline mode, why can't he copy the "HL2 in offline mode" files and steam info and give them to little Jerry? Is it keyed to his specific hardware? If it is, why can't he simply install and log in from little Jerry's computer and validate and go into offline mode there? Is steam going to force him to remove a validated offline mode game from one machine before it lets him validate/offline on another? >It also goes a long way to provide automatic update support for computer >illiterates, and to discourage/detect cheats in MP environments. While i'll grant you cheat detection in MP environment is important, auto updates are bad because they foster continuing illiteracy for the computer illiterates. There's never any incentive to learn if they can just "let the computer do it", until an auto-update patch breaks the program, and they haven't the first clue in finding out why it's not working. So they can call tech support and say "I didn't change anything" and actually be telling the truth, but it's still broken. Has there _ever_ been a patch for a game/app on PC hardware that didn't make things worse for some portion of the people due to hardware differences? >> seconds once he admits that it didn't do jack squat to stop >> pirates. He keeps saying it did, but people are *still* downloading [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >were so illuminating on this subject ensuring we knew that you knew >about dissassembly and rerouting validation SW. This is software that takes credit card numbers and lets you buy online, and is so full of holes (after an entire extra years effort) that people can steal the entire catalog through it? If it's that insecure what's next, a clever hacker adding/modifying a patch and letting thousands of users autoupdate themselves a trojan? Xocyll SignatureI don't particularly want you to FOAD, myself. You'll be more of a cautionary example if you'll FO And Get Chronically, Incurably, Painfully, Progressively, Expensively, Debilitatingly Ill. So FOAGCIPPEDI. -- Mike Andrews responding to an idiot in asr > Ok then, how does validating stop thieves and piracy? > > Lynley It didn't, and doesn't, no matter how much Walter claims otherwise. People are *still* able to exploit steam and get all the .GCF files for the whole game, for free. Right through steam itself. I've posted the site twice now in this thread, and I don't want to do it anymore because it's giving info to people that probably shouldn't have it. But Walter needs to be cuffed by the ear and dragged to a screen to see that site and be forced to face up to reality and get out of his dreamworld. Steam did *nothing* whatsoever to stop piracy. And in the process, it made thousands of customers extremely pissed off about having to haul their machines to someone elses house to install (if they had no internet connect), or waiting hours on the first day for dial up to register. Walter's entire house of cards is based on the fact that Steam stopped or slowed down pirates. So he cannot possibly accept that it did not, or the whole thing collapses. And yet Steam is a complete and utter failure in this regard. It didn't stop anyone, people got it right from steam itself, and there are hundereds of full versions floating on the net, no cd cracks, steam emulators.. Hell, people can still play CSS online with cracked versions. The *fact* is, Valve is incompetent on security issues. There is no denying that. Unless you are in denial with your head in the sand and arguing because you don't know how to do anything else. Wake up Walter!!!! >>Ok then, how does validating stop thieves and piracy? >> [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > > Steam did *nothing* whatsoever to stop piracy. And in Rubbish. It discouraged casual copying. Steam is more tan that though. I controls and manages the platform for the games. It provides updates. It is not all about stopping you thieving games Jim. In comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action Jim Vieira <Whiplashr@wi.rr.com.remove.this.to.reply> wrote: > Wake up Walter!!!! so after reading your fifth tirade against walter, even though you said you've killfiled him, it occurs to me that just a few days ago you were whining about michael vondong and i continually trashing you because we were supposedly still bitter about previous arguments. and not only are you guilty of the same, but you seem to be still bitter over previous roommates as well. i seriously wonder if there's any element of jim's personality he wont lash out against when he notices it in other people. the dude's got issues. > > > At least, according to the steam website, the latest steam update is > > > SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > If it is legit, why do I have to keep validating its legitimacy? > Very weak, Walter. Because it does such a wonderful job of stopping piracy! Why, that's not too much to ask is it? To verify your purchase, to help stop piracy? Oh wait, the problem is, HL2 was pirated every bit as badly (or worse) than any other game out there. 50000 steam accounts closed for exploit downloading it on the first day of release. Dozens of torrents of functional versions all over the web in a matter of days. In case Walter is still in denial, I suggest checking out this site: http://cs.rin.ru/forum/viewforum.php?f=10&sid=9759ef9d0b60cfdad5d11999f92c0b76 > http://cs.rin.ru/forum/viewforum.php?f=10&sid=9759ef9d0b60cfdad5d11999f92c0b76 Where did I ever deny this Jim? Where? Do tell. Making things up to support your rabid ravings don't make you right you know? Go take a pill and have a lie down. Nurse will be along in a minute. >Well said Riku. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open >a steam A/C (and only because I'm being FORCED to). Well there still isn't an option to not connect to play SP games in the Steam bought version. So how exactly is it suppose to be easier to play offline? > Well there still isn't an option to not connect to play SP games in > the Steam bought version. So how exactly is it suppose to be easier to > play offline? The option has *always* been there for HL2. (Offline mode for Steam was addded around Spring 2004) If you have not updated Steam in the past week, you wouldn't have noticed that Offline mode was made easier to use, all you have to do now with the latest update is simply press "cancel" when Steam is trying to login, and it will offer you the option to play Offline. SignatureBen Cottrell AKA Bench >> Well there still isn't an option to not connect to play SP games in >> the Steam bought version. So how exactly is it suppose to be easier to [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >with the latest update is simply press "cancel" when Steam is trying to >login, and it will offer you the option to play Offline. Strange. I just tried that and it doesn't work. I hit Cancel repeatedly and it still pops up with my Steam games list. If I hit it before the Cancel text turns white the program just quits. >>If you have not updated Steam in the past week, you wouldn't have > >noticed that Offline mode was made easier to use, all you have to do now [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > still pops up with my Steam games list. If I hit it before the Cancel text > turns white the program just quits. The only way I can get offline mode to work is to pull my network cable or to disable my network connection temporarily. Hardly even worth it, so 99% of the time I play, Valve is able to see that I'm playing. >>>If you have not updated Steam in the past week, you wouldn't have >>>noticed that Offline mode was made easier to use, all you have to do now [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > Hardly even worth it, so 99% of the time I play, Valve is able > to see that I'm playing. Or hit "cancel" when starting steam. Yawn. Next. Steam is a developing platform. You didn't write it Jim so there are issues : but it seems to me and andy sane reader that Valve are addressing the issues and providing a damn stable, solid platform for their game catalog. SignatureWalter Mitty - Useless, waste of money research of the day : http://tinyurl.com/6yh2f http://www.tinyurl.com >>If you have not updated Steam in the past week, you wouldn't have >>noticed that Offline mode was made easier to use, all you have to do now [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >still pops up with my Steam games list. If I hit it before the Cancel text >turns white the program just quits. Especially in Steam's case, theory and practise are two wildly different things. ;-) Just like the previous "offline mode timer" feature... err, "bug". ;-) In theory there are no such problems in Steam you are describing. According to those who never use the offline mode, it works great and flawlessly. Figures. >Well said Riku. > [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >SUPPOSED to make offline playing easier ... we'll see once I open >a steam A/C (and only because I'm being FORCED to). And you can just imagine what difool would say if Valve shut down Steam and left all the players out there without updates or MP. "Valve sold us down the river!" etc. > And you can just imagine what difool would say if Valve shut down Steam > and > left all the players out there without updates or MP. "Valve sold us down > the > river!" etc. No. It would be more like... The bastard monster Valve have selling there faitfull customer down river ! >>Well said Riku. >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >left all the players out there without updates or MP. "Valve sold us down the >river!" etc. Well ahh wouldn't it be true ? >>>Well said Riku. >>> [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] > >Well ahh wouldn't it be true ? Yes but I was trying to point out that no matter what Valve did difool would still find fault with it. Kind of like the Opposition I guess. > Yes but I was trying to point out that no matter what Valve did > difool would still find fault with it. Kind of like the Opposition > I guess. LIAR!!!! if valve sold hl2 in a cd/dvd without the humiliation of needing to ask for permission to use it, and made patches available for free in file format i would stop the complaints all together! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html > LIAR!!!! > if valve sold hl2 in a cd/dvd without the humiliation of needing to > ask for permission to use it, You have to ask for permission to use every game. It's called the End User License Agreement. If you were a computer owner, you should know that already. > You have to ask for permission to use every game. It's called the End User > License Agreement. If you were a computer owner, you should know that > already. don't manipulate!!!! don't try it again! is it the only thing you have left? don't EVER "compare": during a game installation having to "click" with my mouse in a button which says "i accept" to . requiring my gaming pc to have a internet connection . requiring my gaming pc to be connected to the internet when installing . require myself to contact the publisher via internet and ask him specifically if i can use a game i've just bought and wait patiently for a reply which can take more than one hour!!!! . having to renew this humiliating "ask for permission" at specific times decided by the publisher . and knowing each time i launch the game i can see the message "sorry but this game is no longer available to play" no mr hank its not remotely the same! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html > . require myself to contact the publisher via internet and ask him > specifically if i can use a game i've just bought and wait patiently > for a reply which can take more than one hour!!!! Do you actually have the game? Because you don't have to do that at all... >>. require myself to contact the publisher via internet and ask him >> specifically if i can use a game i've just bought and wait patiently >> for a reply which can take more than one hour!!!! > > Do you actually have the game? Because you don't have to do that at all... No. He doesn't. Gets his info from selected posts. Signature"Nothing in the world is more dangerous than sincere ignorance and conscientious stupidity." Martin Luther King, Jr. > Do you actually have the game? Because you don't have to do that at all... i don't have to own it to know about it if you buy what is sold in retail this will happen you install the game using your cd/dvd and at the end you will need to connect to the internet to validate your copy this is what i call . "require myself to contact the publisher via internet" . "ask him specifically if i can use a game" obviously this is done in a completely automated way and without the user knowing whats happening then you have to wait for the confirmation that the process has finished and that's what i call . "wait patiently for a reply which can take more than one hour" now the hour thing... it can vary but i remember very well when hl2 was released and because of the load in the servers there were gamers you wrote they needed many hours for the process to finish so please don't even try to deny any of this! cause its the truth! each gamer which buys hl2 in a retail store must do this to ever play the game this only happens with hl2! i'll repeat, there is no other single-player game for the pc which makes it MANDATORY doing all this humiliation process! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html >>Do you actually have the game? Because you don't have to do that at all... > > i don't have to own it to know about it Classic... Hank the Rapper <xflopgoon@REMOVEyahoo.com> wrote in message sbSdne8ogJOp9XvcRVn-uQ@giganews.com... > > LIAR!!!! > > if valve sold hl2 in a cd/dvd without the humiliation of needing to [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > License Agreement. If you were a computer owner, you should know that > already. Personally, I regard the EULA as complete crap, and not binding at all. At least for pieces of software for which a policy of "no return if opened" is applied by the seller. The EULA explicitly says that if I do not agree with its provisions I am entitled to a full refund, but I couldn't ever have one when I (as an experiment) decided not to install a game after reading it and decided to get back my money instead. The argument used was "but you might have copied it" - which is ludicrous. And I think that it would be very,very difficult to have the EULa upholded in a court, anyway - no contract can be binding if its imposed after the sale. Of course, there are a lots of things that I cannot do with a piece of software I bought, because the law protects it, and that may often cover much of the same grounds as the EULA. And I fully respect the law - at least to the best of my knowledge and ability. Alfredo >> Yes but I was trying to point out that no matter what Valve did >> difool would still find fault with it. Kind of like the Opposition [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >ask for permission to use it, and made patches available for free in >file format i would stop the complaints all together! Liar? Flat out wrong maybe but not a liar. Could you not just imagine that they had done that and stop the complaints anyway. Pretty please? :-) > Liar? Flat out wrong maybe but not a liar. Could you not just imagine that > they had done that and stop the complaints anyway. Pretty please? :-) ok, i'm sorry to call you liar, but don't forget since a month ago i've been flamed, insulted in this group and evidently over reacted with you as for the later part, i'm not doing on purpose but cause english is not my first language i really can understand what you mean, but in respect to what you wrote in the previous post i can only say this "i'll go running to buy hl2 retail if valve takes steam from it!" i only complain about valve cause they created steam i only complain about hl2 cause it has steam without steam i'll stop complaining! all my issues are with steam and specially with steam being mandatory you like steam, so please buy and download hl2 using it i don't like steam, so let me have a proper hl2 retail version without it if you like steam you should use it but what makes me real mad in valve making it mandatory its like "or you accept it or you are out" and its an extremely arrogant attitude from valve, and i can only justify it by and evil plan they have for the future for them hl2 is secondary, what is important is steam and steam be running in every gaming pc! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html >> Liar? Flat out wrong maybe but not a liar. Could you not just imagine >> that >> they had done that and stop the complaints anyway. Pretty please? :-) > > ok, i'm sorry to call you liar, but don't forget since a month ago i've > been flamed, insulted in this group and evidently over reacted with you That's because you act like a 12 year old, constipated geek. >> Liar? Flat out wrong maybe but not a liar. Could you not just imagine that >> they had done that and stop the complaints anyway. Pretty please? :-) [quoted text clipped - 20 lines] >for them hl2 is secondary, what is important is steam and steam be running >in every gaming pc! I suppose in an ideal world as you suggest Steam would be an option. If they released standard downloadable patches via HTTP/FTP for some and Steam for those who want it everyone would win up to a point. >>>Liar? Flat out wrong maybe but not a liar. Could you not just imagine that >>>they had done that and stop the complaints anyway. Pretty please? :-) [quoted text clipped - 24 lines] > released standard downloadable patches via HTTP/FTP for some and Steam for > those who want it everyone would win up to a point. But they havent. Steam is central to the their support philosophy. Its like saying that publishers should still release on floppy. Its not an ideal world. Why doesnt diFool just STFU and move on : if he doesnt like Steam because of all his conspiracy theories then fine - don't buy the f.cking thing. SignatureWalter Mitty - Useless, waste of money research of the day : http://tinyurl.com/6yh2f http://www.tinyurl.com >2. Drop the online validation requirement for the single-player game >of the RETAIL (CD/DVD) version so that people who rather want to buy a [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >the update of their choice, if they so wish. Just like they can do >with all their other PC games. Hear, hear. >like that one anti-piracy lawyer claiming that the only home-users who >want and need a broadband internet connection are pirates, others are >fine with a dialup connection for their web browsing and emails. ;-) I take it that lawyer didn't work for Valve... or else he just shot his employers in the other foot. ;-) > What is the purpose of that petition anyway? What are you asking Valve > to do, to close down Steam? Or is that petition just a general "Shame > on you, we hate you!" directed to Valve? if you want my personal opinion, i would want steam to be declared illegal and be completely banned from planet earth > A good petition would tell what the signers want Valve to do, for > example: [quoted text clipped - 27 lines] > want and need a broadband internet connection are pirates, others are > fine with a dialup connection for their web browsing and emails. ;-) at this point in time i have an extreme prejudice again valve and steam so the only thing i would want is to make steam go away altogether, but i find your petition proposal very fair, and if you decide to do it, and i think you should! i will sign-in personally it addresses what i call the 3 main unnegotiable requirements when it comes to a publisher selling games . availability in physical cd/dvd medium with a buy once use forever cost . no activation "ask for permission" humiliation . patches freely available and distributed in file format so Riku i agree with your petition proposal, for me you don't need to add anything at all cause it addresses all my personal issue when it comes to steam, so please create it, and i'll be the first to sign-in, but please do create it! don't make this only another idea but make it reality! thanks! -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html > 27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! > so please join us and sign-in at: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > top 10 things to know before buying half-life 2 and accepting steam > http://www.talkaboutcomputing.com/group/comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action/messages/69 3411.html >>27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >>so please join us and sign-in at: [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >>top 10 things to know before buying half-life 2 and accepting steam >>http://www.talkaboutcomputing.com/group/comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action/messages/69 3411.html Springtime for Hilter in Gerrrrmmmaaannnnyyyyy!!! James Garvin bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, white hot flames, and screamed... >>>27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! >>>so please join us and sign-in at: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >Springtime for Hilter in Gerrrrmmmaaannnnyyyyy!!! Godwin. Oh so f.cking Godwin. -- Zag Guns cause crime like flies cause garbage ...bumper sticker > Springtime for Hilter in Gerrrrmmmaaannnnyyyyy!!! steam would be "HIS" choice for selling games and he would make it "official" he would be extremely proud of valve and he would say to them "you are a very good student" -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html difool bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, white hot flames, and screamed... >> Springtime for Hilter in Gerrrrmmmaaannnnyyyyy!!! > >steam would be "HIS" choice for selling games >and he would make it "official" >he would be extremely proud of valve >and he would say to them "you are a very good student" You're a medium and you can channel Hitler? Can you ask him what the hell was up with WW-II? -- Zag Guns cause crime like flies cause garbage ...bumper sticker your comparison is very valid VALVE is the "ruthless dictator" using his "war machine" STEAM i'm from the underground "resistance" which fights for freedom -- post made in a steam-free computer i said "NO" to valve and steam please sign petition "Say NO! to Steam!" available at: http://www.petitiononline.com/nosteam/petition.html difool bolted into comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.rpg, wreathed in wicked, white hot flames, and screamed... >your comparison is very valid >VALVE is the "ruthless dictator" using his "war machine" STEAM >i'm from the underground "resistance" which fights for freedom Yeah, but could you take the Groucho Marx glasses off...? -- Zag Guns cause crime like flies cause garbage ...bumper sticker > your comparison is very valid > VALVE is the "ruthless dictator" using his "war machine" STEAM > i'm from the underground "resistance" which fights for freedom Mate, you sort of missed my point. It's like when people say "Lloyd-Webber really is good, all those dozens of people who pay to listen to his music can't be wrong", and then you say "Two, words: Hitler, Germany", which sort of means "Well, Hitler sure had a lot of Germans fooled for a while there too..." - ah well, never mind... ;o) > 27014 gamers can't be wrong about steam! > so please join us and sign-in at: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > top 10 things to know before buying half-life 2 and accepting steam http://www.talkaboutcomputing.com/group/comp.sys.ibm.pc.games.action/messages/69 3411.html You posted a top 10 things against Steam on a web site even though you've never tested/used it? And what about those poor people who don't have an internet connection; how are they suppose to read this? I figured you would have been going door to door. :) Knock! Knock! Who's there? difool. >You posted a top 10 things against Steam on a web site even though you've i didn't "posted" on a web site, its just "talkaboutcomputing.com" archive all the messages we have been posting here, which frankly i don't think its a good idea... i don't like all of my posts being available forever and btw yours are there too... >never tested/used it? And what about those poor people who don't have an oh come one! you too???? do i need to use everything to know if i like it or not? don't you get opinions from reviews or fellow gamers about games? do you have to buy or play every demo available to know if you like it??? off course not!!! that's been ONE among many things the steam lovers bunch have used against me... cause i haven't bought hl2 i can't say anything bad about steam! bullshit! (sorry for the slang) i know what you want... you want to make me buy hl2 NEVER! OVER MY DEAD BODY! > internet connection; how are they suppose to read this? those without net have already been neglect by valve! those can't play hl2 so they will know hands-on about it i only hope if they mistakenly bought the game, they will have a full refund, cause anyone can miss the very little "internet requirement" at the bottom of the case the ones i'm talking about and need to be informed are dial-up users, pay-by-the-minute users, broadband with low speed, all those need to be informed about not having t |
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