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frame rate for FS X vs. FS9 questions

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michaele@ando.pair.com - 27 Jul 2008 18:08 GMT
I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
2600+ CPU and a fanless Gigabyte NVIDIA 7600 GS video card in an AGP
slot. And the OS is Win XP Pro, SP 2.

I downloaded the sample FS X program and the framerate was around
5fps. Is the sample FS X program telling me that if I buy and install
FS X, I would get much lower fps than in FS9.1? In other words, do I
have to get a computer with a faster CPU and/or faster GPU and
possibly upgrade to Vista to get an acceptable fps rate to run FS X?

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Mike Eisenstadt
Austin, Texas
Bill - 27 Jul 2008 18:17 GMT
> I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
> display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Mike Eisenstadt
> Austin, Texas

The full install of FSX will run like the demo, even after FSX SP1 and SP2.

FSX needs a pretty fast CPU and a very good video card.

As for the OS most reports are that XP runs better than Vista  for games in
general

I have FSX running on vista and it is more sluggish than XP IMHO.

The only thing you get with Vista is DX10 and that's a huge waits of time in
FSX as they give you a "preview" which doesn't work properly. And word is
out DX11 is on the way, well that's another story, another era :-)

Cheers
Bill
Brett I. Holcomb - 27 Jul 2008 18:30 GMT
You have better than what I had!  It will not be a barn burner but it
will run.  I had an AMD Athlon 2000, a 7600 from BFG and found that
there were some missions I could not fly (Innsbruck) and I had to cut
back details.  FSX requires a good processor and a good graphics card.
I have upgraded and now run FSX on Vista 64 bit.

>I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
>display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>Mike Eisenstadt
>Austin, Texas
Bill - 27 Jul 2008 18:40 GMT
Brett I am glad you mentioned Vista 64 bit.  It appears to be the better of
the two vistas both for games and other applications, and drivers are
becoming more and more available.

I am on vista 32

Thanks for that point
Bill

> You have better than what I had!  It will not be a barn burner but it
> will run.  I had an AMD Athlon 2000, a 7600 from BFG and found that
[quoted text clipped - 17 lines]
>>Mike Eisenstadt
>>Austin, Texas
Brett I. Holcomb - 27 Jul 2008 19:01 GMT
You're welcome. I went to it so I can use all my 8 gig of memory.  I
will be running some virtual machines for SQL Server and Windows
Server work so I need all I can get.  The initial install requires 3
gig memory or less until you get all the patches including SP1 and
then it can handle all of it.  So far I like it.  The only thing that
doesn't run is Cisco's VPN client but I have an older version so I'll
need to investigate that.

>Brett I am glad you mentioned Vista 64 bit.  It appears to be the better of
>the two vistas both for games and other applications, and drivers are
[quoted text clipped - 26 lines]
>>>Mike Eisenstadt
>>>Austin, Texas
Dan K. - 27 Jul 2008 18:46 GMT
>I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
> display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Mike Eisenstadt
> Austin, Texas

I have had so many mixed results with FX. It is great when it running
right, but I am getting sick of always tweaking it. It just seems to run ok
sometimes and then lousy at other times for no reason. I find my myself
enjoying FS9 more and more with all the sliders set to Max with no stutters
and crashes.

Running a dual Core Intel 3.20 hz ....3 gigs Ram...ATI Radeon  1060 512..XP
pro SP3. I would figue my system would not have any problems.. Who wants to
go out and spend big money on a  graphics card when all other applications
run great .

It it just a poorly designed program in my oponion.

If the demo is running bad, I would not expect you to see any inprovement
purchasing the full version.

Dan
Nats - 28 Jul 2008 20:09 GMT
> I have had so many mixed results with FX. It is great when it running
> right, but I am getting sick of always tweaking it. It just seems to run
[quoted text clipped - 13 lines]
>
> Dan

I run FSX on an AMD 4800 (Dual 2.4 Gz Processors) with a rather cheapish
7800 Nvidea card and it runs very well with 1100x900 (or whatever)
resolution, antiailiasing on, anisotropic filtering (a must for a decent
looking game in my opinion), most of the sliders set at high and the texture
etc sliders all set to max. I havent noticed any real slowdowns the game
looks fantastic and very playable in the missions. I havent tried any major
airports really but cant imagine it will be much different. But I dont have
any major addons or super complex planes like the PDMG 747 etc. I very happy
with it. Oh yes and this is on Win XP Home with Directx9. I dont know how
well the demo runs but it was suprisingly smooth even on my last computer
but then I had a much better graphics card on that computer but the computer
itself wasnt brilliant something like a 2.4 single processor I think). The
very gopd graphics card made a lot of difference to the redraws when you
move the views around. I had a Radeon X600 for that computer and really
regret selling it with the computer. I really dont know why everyone keeps
going on and on about FSX being slow I have found it to be very smooth and
very gradable without losing much of the niceties. And the missions that
come with it are really good well worth upgrading IMOP although I did really
like the FS9 missions as well and miss some of those.

Nats
RandyL - 27 Jul 2008 19:53 GMT
Hi Mike,
   Yes, that has pretty much been the experience of most of us. FSX runs
slower framerates than FS9 does, even on very high-end machines. Last year I
bought a brand-new high-end computer system specifically for use with FSX.
When I run FS9 on it, with every  display and scenery slider maxed out, I
get between 50 and 60 FPS, even in the high traffic, high polygon scenery
areas. But when I run FSX on the same machine, I can only get framerates in
the mid to upper 20's, and that is only if I set my display and graphic
sliders about half way, and only after tweaking my fsx.cfg file to within an
inch of its life.
   Don't get me wrong, I love the way that FSX looks. I think right out of
the box that it looks much better than FS9 does, even after installing
scenery upgrades and special effects for FS9. Its just that FSX doesn't have
as fast of framerates as FS9 does.
   By the way, don't get excited about FSX's ability to run DX10. I bought
Windows Vista, with DX10 on my new computer, with a high-power DX10 video
card, and FSX still doesn't run DX10 right. Many of my aircraft don't load
their textures when running DX10, and many scenery glitches occur while
running DX10. In my personal opinion, FSX "DX10 Preview" is not exactly
ready for prime time yet.

Randy L.

Is a caterpillar even capable of imagining
what life is like as a butterfly?

--------------------------------------------------
From: <michaele@ando.pair.com>
Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2008 11:08 AM
Newsgroups: alt.games.microsoft.flight-sim
Subject: frame rate for FS X vs. FS9 questions

> I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
> display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Mike Eisenstadt
> Austin, Texas

> Austin, Texas
Greasy Rider - 28 Jul 2008 22:51 GMT
> Is a caterpillar even capable of imagining
> what life is like as a butterfly?

Two caterpillars are crawling across the grass and a butterfly goes by
just inches above their heads.
One turns and tells the other:

(drum roll)

"You could never get me up in one of those things".

Greasy Rider
Dallas - 27 Jul 2008 21:40 GMT
> In other words, do I have to get a computer with a faster CPU and/or faster GPU and
> possibly upgrade to Vista to get an acceptable fps rate to run FS X?

Yes.  

I've got an AMD Athlon XP 3200+ and a nVIDIA GeForce 6800 GT and I can
"run" FSX with frame rates of 15ish.  

The trouble is..  I have to shut off a great deal of the new eye candy to
get those frame rates and the net result doesn't make it better than FS9.1.

The demo runs better than the full program because the islands don't have
the scenery density.  

This is just my opinion...  the "improvements" in FSX didn't impress me
enough to make want to build a new computer to run it.  I'm doing fine with
FS9.1.

Signature

Dallas

James McTavish - 27 Jul 2008 22:31 GMT
"michaele@ando.pair.com" <michaele@ando.pair.com> wrote in news:28ecd99d-
4efc-45af-b3d5-a63057f14340@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com:

> I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
> display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Mike Eisenstadt
> Austin, Texas

You find 25fps acceptable? To me acceptable has to be 40fps or more. I get
well over 60fps in FS9. You need a faster PC, end of story.
mdavis - 28 Jul 2008 00:31 GMT
I think there is some mis-understanding here in comparison of frame rates
between FS9 and FSX.  The framerate shown is not an accurate indicator of
the illusion of motion when flying.  There are posts from some of the
Microsoft gurus who said (and I concur) that FSX is much smoother at a given
framerate than FS9 at the "same" indicated rate.  I also find on my high end
system that the FSX framerate is much less "stable" as indicated in the
display than FS9 was, so I don't think it is accurate to say that FSX must
run at a certain rate in order to be as good as FS9.  My FSX counter may
drop into the teens for a very brief second at highly populated, large
airports, but I never get a stutter or temporary freeze during taxi on the
ground as FS9 used to do.  Enroute rates are mid-40s-50s with occasional
jumps over 100, and I've even seen better than 200 for a split second!  This
is, of course, worthless with a 60Hz screen refresh rate on most LCD
monitors.

I also think the SP1/Acceleration upgrades did help those of us who have
multiple core or hyperthreaded CPUs as some of the background processing is
multi-threaded more efficiently to non-dominant cores, virtual or otherwise.
On a quad-core machine, I'm finding that most slider settings have little or
no effect on displayed framerates, and I'm running sliders where I want
them, not where the computer seems to need them.

My first FSX install was on a 3.2GHz  P4 HT machine, 840MHz FSB (slightly
overclocked)  with 2 gigs of RAM and an nVidia 5900 Ultra (256 Meg) card.
It runs acceptably well on that machine with FS Genesis terrain mesh,
ActiveSkyX and Ultimate TerrainX installed but with most sliders midway or
less.  The SP1 patch did help framerates on this machine a bit (running in
hyperthreaded mode), but if you aren't running a hyperthreaded CPU, it may
do nothing for you, and it may not help on AMD chips.  Framerates in the
lower teens still give me a smooth visual display, although large airports
bring it to its knees unless you back off on some settings while you're on
the ground.  Enroute, things are fine.  That machine runs FS9 like a champ
with frames in the mid-30s or better, but I still got glitches, stutters and
a few other things -- not bad, but a bit distracting at time.  I would say
that FSX at 15 fps runs as smoothly as FS9 at 25 fps, although you can't
compare them directly.  Turn the framerate counter off and enjoy the sim.
It's a diagnostic tool unless you just like having it on-screen.

Mike Davis
Intel 3.2GHz Quad core, 1600MHz FSB
Asus Formula Rampage mobo
Vista 64 with 4 gigs of RAM
nVidia 9800 GTX o/c to 715MHz core
Brett I. Holcomb - 28 Jul 2008 00:39 GMT
Good points.  Even as far back as FS2000 I felt we can get too wrapped
up in frame rates.  The key is that the sim flys smoothly and with no
stuttering irregardless of framerates.   And since we don't know how
FSX and FS9 actually compute framereates we can't really compare them.
At best it's a general indicator.

>I think there is some mis-understanding here in comparison of frame rates
>between FS9 and FSX.  The framerate shown is not an accurate indicator of
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>is, of course, worthless with a 60Hz screen refresh rate on most LCD
>monitors.
snippped

>Mike Davis
>Intel 3.2GHz Quad core, 1600MHz FSB
>Asus Formula Rampage mobo
>Vista 64 with 4 gigs of RAM
>nVidia 9800 GTX o/c to 715MHz core
Dallas - 28 Jul 2008 01:23 GMT
> Intel 3.2GHz Quad core, 1600MHz FSB
> Asus Formula Rampage mobo
> Vista 64 with 4 gigs of RAM
> nVidia 9800 GTX o/c to 715MHz core

That's a nice box!

Signature

Dallas

Ken - 28 Jul 2008 04:07 GMT
>That's a nice box!

Isn't that what the sailor said to the....oh never mind. :-)))))

CK
mdavis - 28 Jul 2008 05:15 GMT
Yes, thank you.  I had the P4 HT since 2003 and it was time.  Built this one
up using one of the new 45nm Intel Yorkshire chips (Q9450) and it rocks!
Air cooled with seven fans in a big CoolerMaster Cosmos 1000 case.  Rock
solid and completely stable.  Probably good until the next generation of FS
comes out, then it will be obsolete.  I was overdue.
Ibby - 30 Jul 2008 20:07 GMT
>Intel Yorkshire chips

Do you get Steak and Kidney Pie with those 'type' of chips? LOL

Ibby
Danny - 28 Jul 2008 15:28 GMT
Michael, If you are one who concentrates on Frame Rates, steer clear of
FS10.  I run it on a laptop with Vista and my FPS runs 9 to 30 depending on
where in the sim world I am. American TV operates at approximately 35 FPS
which I find to be most smooth.  I do not expect to achieve that with my
system.  Anything above 10 or 12 FPS is acceptable with me. I rarely display
the FPS. Some will want 50FPS the try to tweak that to get 60, then 70.  I
prefer to spend my time flying and not tweaking, so I don't go that route of
constantly spending and upgrading.

I do believe FS10 will run differently on two similar machines with the same
equipment and same programs installed. It is a strange program at times.  If
you can afford it, get the Premium edition of FS10. Install the service
packs and just see what you get. No one can really predict. I was told I
would never be able to run it on a laptop.  I still fly FS9 a great deal,
too.  My laptop runs FS9 Really Well and with my FS9 add-ons, it looks so
good.
Danny

>I am running FS9.1 and getting very acceptable frame rates with
> display set to max realism. 25fps more or less. This is with an AMD XP
[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
> Mike Eisenstadt
> Austin, Texas
 
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