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Game Forum / Role Playing Games / Final Fantasy / January 2007Nintendo DS sticks a sword down PS3's throat - DRAGON QUEST 9 on DS, not PS3
TALK ABOUT A MEGATON http://www.famitsu.com/blog/express/2006/12/ixds.html http://www.cubed3.com/news/6441/1/Dragon_Quest_IX_DS_Confirmed! http://www.kotaku.com/gaming/square+enix/dragon-quest-ix-coming-to-nintendo-ds-2 21070.php http://www.gaming-age.com/news/2006/12/12-21 http://www.rpgamer.com/news/Q4-2006/121106a.html http://www.n-sider.com/newsview.php?type=story&storyid=2555 http://www.gamesarefun.com/news.php?newsid=7333 http://ds.ign.com/articles/750/750590p1.html Dragon Quest 9 Set for DS Square Enix brings Japan's favorite series to Japan's favorite system. by Anoop Gantayat December 11, 2006 - Square Enix held a press conference in Tokyo today to announce the next entry in the main Dragon Quest series. In a surprise move, Japan's most popular series will continue not on the PS3 or the Wii, as many had expected. Instead, Square Enix will be bringing the game to the DS. The full name of Dragon Quest 9 is Dragon Quest 9: Hoshizora no Mamoribito. The surname can be translated to "Protectors of the sky." Level 5 will be handling development on the game. The hot-shot development studio headed up development on Dragon Quest 8, before turning to a couple of projects for Sony. On the DS, the studio is currently working on Professor Layton and the Mysterious Village, to be self-published early next year. Development staff on Level 5's end is the same as from Dragon Quest 8, right down to company president Akihiro Hino, who's serving as producer. Other staff members should come as no surprise. Series father Yuji Horii, heading up the project once again, was in attendance at the press conference, and said, "The DS version is not a side-story, but a true part of the series." Kouichi Sugiyama will be lending his talents to the game's soundtrack. And all future Dragon Quest soundtracks, it seems, as he took the stage today to say "I will continue making Dragon Quest music until I die." Development seems to be quite far along. The online arms of magazines Famitsu and Gemaga, report that a demo was held at the press conference, with Horii and other guests playing the game live. Dragon Quest 9 features an action-oriented battle system playable cooperatively by up to four players via Wi-Fi. This is the first network-based Dragon Quest, Horii noted. The DS's dual screen setup is also put to use, with the top screen showing a map and the bottom screen housing all the action. Horii is aiming for a Japanese release some time in 2007. With Dragon Quest 8 pulling in favorable sales internationally, expect a release outside of Japan to follow. SCORE for DS owners! ^.^.v I'm guessing we have Final Fantasy III to blame for this one...seeing as it came out looking as awesome as FF7 did for its time, and then some, on a tiny little flash cart...  SignatureI used to have a gay sofa. Now I have a hetero sectional. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ The Eternal Lost Lurker www.lurkerdrome.com > TALK ABOUT A MEGATON <snip> Wait... how can a game that's meant for one of the two brand spanking new systems work on the DS - a portable system? Is the DS -that- good??? o_O > Is the DS -that- good??? o_O Yes. > > Is the DS -that- good??? o_O *points at Final Fantasy III* Any other questions? SignatureI used to have a gay sofa. Now I have a hetero sectional. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ The Eternal Lost Lurker www.lurkerdrome.com >>> Is the DS -that- good??? o_O > > *points at Final Fantasy III* > > Any other questions? Not having gotten a DS yet, I haven't played FF3. I guess, if it's as good as people say it is, I'm going to have to suck it up and buy one. >> TALK ABOUT A MEGATON > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Is the DS -that- good??? o_O It's that popular. >> TALK ABOUT A MEGATON > [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > > Is the DS -that- good??? o_O The DS is the best selling system in Japan, it is basically a social phenomenon there. Also for a developer to make a profit on a PS3 game they basically have to sell 500,000 copies of the game. SignatureAll Purpose Culture Randomness http://www.angelfire.com/tx/apcr/index.html In article <ZPXfh.485326$QZ1.343061@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Ethan Hammond <eshammond@worldnet.att.net> wrote: > >> TALK ABOUT A MEGATON > > [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > phenomenon there. Also for a developer to make a profit on a > PS3 game they basically have to sell 500,000 copies of the game. Ah, well. The only place I have to play games is at home, so a portable is rather pointless. Guess I'll miss out on all the good games for now on :) SignatureChris Mack "Refugee, total sh.t. That's how I've always seen us. 'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us." -'Deal/No Deal', CHESS >In article ><ZPXfh.485326$QZ1.343061@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Ethan [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] >is rather pointless. Guess I'll miss out on all the good games for now >on :) There some law saying you can't play your portable at home? -- "Lyrical Tokarev! Kill them All!" - Touge Chan Abraham Evangelista >>In article >><ZPXfh.485326$QZ1.343061@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Ethan [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > >There some law saying you can't play your portable at home? What's the point of playing something with a tiny screen and an unergonomic design at home when a console or PC is much more comfortable? Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from playing with larger, more powerful devices. Because of this, portable games are supposed to be quick to play and enjoy during the time you spend on the subway or a ten-minute coffee break. This recent trend of making games for portables which don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 > What's the point of playing something with a tiny screen and an > unergonomic design at home when a console or PC is much more > comfortable? Because it's a fun system? > Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from > playing with larger, more powerful devices. And yet, that doesn't stop a lot of people from playing them on their couch, just like any other console. This Penny Arcade post from 2002 is illustrative: Playing Metroid Fusion last week, I realized that though I undoubtedly had a very powerful, portable system in the GBA, the only place I ever play it is in my house on the couch. I used to play it primarily in the bathroom, owing to the fact that bathroom lights are somehow the perfect illumination for the machine, but with the advent of the Afterburner I can play it even in a dark cave. Which I sometimes do. http://www.penny-arcade.com/2002/11/20 > Because of this, portable games are supposed to be quick to play > and enjoy during the time you spend on the subway or a ten-minute > coffee break. Which also make them ideal for picking up briefly at home when you have a few minutes between kids screaming, honey-do items, and cleaning up after the dog. > This recent trend of making games for portables which > don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. Yeah, it sucks when people make you buy games you don't want to play. -=Eric >> This recent trend of making games for portables which >> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. > >Yeah, it sucks when people make you buy games you don't want to play. No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems that they don't belong on. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>> This recent trend of making games for portables which >>> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems that they > don't belong on. And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >>>> This recent trend of making games for portables which >>>> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > >And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? I think I already mentioned that. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>>> This recent trend of making games for portables which >>>>> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > > I think I already mentioned that. And your authority is derived from? >>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >> >> I think I already mentioned that. > > And your authority is derived from? His authority derives from his argument (that different types of gaming system have different properties, and hence support different styles of games). So, if you want to challenge his authority, you're going to have to address his argument. > >>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? > >> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > games). So, if you want to challenge his authority, you're going to have > to address his argument. Except that if a game is an exclusive release for a system, you would think that it would be programmed so it would work well on that system. This also ignores the idea that there is an untapped market for certain types of games for certain systems (i.e. an RPG game that can be taken with you, which would be perfect for an RPG game player who is constantly on the go) and that a videogame company creates a agem in order to tap that market. >> >>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >> >> [quoted text clipped - 15 lines] >constantly on the go) and that a videogame company creates a agem in >order to tap that market. Funny, that's exactly what gets played in my Micro most often. I keep an RPG in there, and just do a screen or a battle or two whenever I find myself wiht an extra 5 mintues or so. I'm fighitng my way through lunar legend right now. Before that it was FFII, and Golden SUns. RPGS with save points and the like, are almost ideally suited for this platform. -- "Lyrical Tokarev! Kill them All!" - Touge Chan Abraham Evangelista >> >>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >> >> [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] >Except that if a game is an exclusive release for a system, you would >think that it would be programmed so it would work well on that system. Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly different from other Dragon Quest games. You shouldn't make dramatic changes to a numbered series, especially when it's one that has been notably anti-evolution like DQ has. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>>>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >>>>> [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > changes to a numbered series, especially when it's one that has been > notably anti-evolution like DQ has. You mean like DQ 7 and preceeding, all of which were on systems inferior to the DS, except for 7, which was on par? The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it won't be as pretty. >> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed >> so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it > won't be as pretty. I'm sure it's just a coincidence that after eight single-player, turn-based Dragon Quests, they're switching to "an action-oriented battle system playable cooperatively by up to four players" at the same time as the series moves to a handheld system. RelMark >>> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed >>> so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] > battle system playable cooperatively by up to four players" at the > same time as the series moves to a handheld system. Could they not do that on the PS3? Is there something about the DS that forces that? Is there ANYTHING to actually tie your conspiracy theory to the facts? > >>> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed > >>> so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > > Could they not do that on the PS3? Depends. If the four players can go off on their own a bit, and don't have to all stay in the same screen, that's easier to do well if each player in fact has their own individual screen. SignatureChris Mack "Refugee, total sh.t. That's how I've always seen us. 'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us." -'Deal/No Deal', CHESS >>>>> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be >>>>> programmed so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > have to all stay in the same screen, that's easier to do well if each > player in fact has their own individual screen. I'm assuming the PS3 also has online capablilites. The point is that it's not something that's specific to the DS. > >>>>> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be > >>>>> programmed so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > I'm assuming the PS3 also has online capablilites. The point is that it's > not something that's specific to the DS. Not requiring online play to have the feature is, and being able to play with friends all in the same room would be a plus... SignatureChris Mack "Refugee, total sh.t. That's how I've always seen us. 'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us." -'Deal/No Deal', CHESS >>> The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it >>> won't be as pretty. [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] >Could they not do that on the PS3? Is there something about the DS that >forces that? Is there ANYTHING to actually tie your conspiracy theory to So you're saying that it is a coincidence? That's a rather unlikely coincidence. Anyway, to answer your questions, yes. The disadvantages that I've already described for the DS would indeed force some changes for the game to cover them up, and these are the changes that Squenix chose. Co-op play because it takes advantage of the system's portability, and action-based play because it reduces the amount of time that it takes to accomplish something in the game. They wouldn't have bothered making these changes if the game was going to be on the PS3, especially since co-op play would not work nearly as well on it. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>> The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is >>>> it won't be as pretty. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > So you're saying that it is a coincidence? That's a rather unlikely > coincidence. Is there something about the DS that forces action-oriented, as opposed to traditional RPG-style (so long as Y's isn't your traditional RPG of choice)? Is there something about the PS3 that prohibits it? Unless you can answer yes to either of these questions, I'm going to call your theory "kookery." As far as the co-op portion, I'll just say "if you can do it, why not give it a go?" Having decided to go with the DS, they figured it would be interesting to take advantage of the wifi. I highly doubt that the mere existance of the wifi option prompted them to change the fundamental nature of DQ9's gameplay. That would be the tail wagging the dog. Unless Nintendo decreed that any game for the DS MUST take advantage of the wifi capabilities. > Anyway, to answer your questions, yes. The disadvantages that I've > already described for the DS would indeed force some changes for the Which disadvantages? > game to cover them up, and these are the changes that Squenix chose. > Co-op play because it takes advantage of the system's portability, and > action-based play because it reduces the amount of time that it takes > to accomplish something in the game. They wouldn't have bothered And yet, the fact that plenty of us enjoy RPGs on portables still hasn't suggested to you yet that the "time to accomplish" really doesn't matter as much as you think it does? I don't exactly sit down and say "this is a portable, so I want to get more done faster," or "this is a console game, so I don't care if it's slow going." > making these changes if the game was going to be on the PS3, > especially since co-op play would not work nearly as well on it. So, changes in gameplay are ONLY sparked by changes in systems? >>>>> The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is >>>>> it won't be as pretty. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] >traditional RPG-style (so long as Y's isn't your traditional RPG of choice)? >Is there something about the PS3 that prohibits it? Unless you can answer I believe I answered both of those questions below. >As far as the co-op portion, I'll just say "if you can do it, why not give >it a go?" Having decided to go with the DS, they figured it would be Because it doesn't belong in the series? >interesting to take advantage of the wifi. I highly doubt that the mere >existance of the wifi option prompted them to change the fundamental nature >of DQ9's gameplay. That would be the tail wagging the dog. The tail has been wagging the dog in Squenix for years. >> game to cover them up, and these are the changes that Squenix chose. >> Co-op play because it takes advantage of the system's portability, and >> action-based play because it reduces the amount of time that it takes >> to accomplish something in the game. They wouldn't have bothered > >And yet, the fact that plenty of us enjoy RPGs on portables still hasn't Didn't I already argue with you about how the fact that plenty of people "enjoy" MMORPGs doesn't actually make them any fun? I think that was you. Anyway, while traditional console RPGs on portables are still fun at least, they would be more fun on consoles. >> making these changes if the game was going to be on the PS3, >> especially since co-op play would not work nearly as well on it. > >So, changes in gameplay are ONLY sparked by changes in systems? No, but they are in this case. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 > You mean like DQ 7 and preceeding, all of which were on systems inferior > to the DS, except for 7, which was on par? > > The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it won't > be as pretty. And they can make more money and sell more copies w/ it on the DS! It is all aboot the bottom line, BOTTOM LINE! SignatureAll Purpose Culture Randomness http://www.angelfire.com/tx/apcr/index.html >> You mean like DQ 7 and preceeding, all of which were on systems inferior >> to the DS, except for 7, which was on par? [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >And they can make more money and sell more copies w/ it on the DS! They might do that. I still think it's an open question whether or not they will, as compared to what they could've done--released the DS game as a spinoff and then a couple of years later put DQ9 on one of the next-gen consoles. There's no rule saying that DQ9 has to be out next year; we just had DQ8 last year. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>> You mean like DQ 7 and preceeding, all of which were on systems >>> inferior to the DS, except for 7, which was on par? [quoted text clipped - 9 lines] > the next-gen consoles. There's no rule saying that DQ9 has to be out > next year; we just had DQ8 last year. Didn't you say they were only in it for the money (though not why that's a bad thing)? If they are, then some of their marketing gurus have figured out that they stand to make the most money this way. And, while I think SE has been lacking heart and soul, as of late, I can't say anything bad about their bean counters (I mean, we're not talking Sega, here). If SE thinks they can make more money this way, I'm inclined to believe them. >>>> You mean like DQ 7 and preceeding, all of which were on systems >>>> inferior to the DS, except for 7, which was on par? [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >Didn't you say they were only in it for the money (though not why that's a >bad thing)? If they are, then some of their marketing gurus have figured Yes, yes I did. That is the crux of the problem. And it's obviously a bad thing because it interferes with the quality of the games they make. Do you think that Van Gogh's paintings would have been as awe-inspiring as they were if he had been willing to compromise his own art to make them more profitable? The DQ games certainly aren't as good as those paintings, but it's the same problem. >out that they stand to make the most money this way. And, while I think SE >has been lacking heart and soul, as of late, I can't say anything bad about >their bean counters (I mean, we're not talking Sega, here). If SE thinks >they can make more money this way, I'm inclined to believe them. In the short run they will. I'm not so sure about the long run, something which Squenix doesn't seem to have cared so much about as of late. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed >> so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >You mean like DQ 7 and preceeding, all of which were on systems inferior to >the DS, except for 7, which was on par? What do you mean? I'm not talking about the graphics here; those are of minor importance and only mentioned to further describe Squenix's inconsistency in recent years. >The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it won't >be as pretty. And it will be on a portable. That itself either means that it will be unsuitable for the system or it will be changed to be made suitable for the system. Reports make it sound like the latter will be true. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed >>> so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > of minor importance and only mentioned to further describe Squenix's > inconsistency in recent years. Then you've really got no point. >> The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it >> won't be as pretty. > > And it will be on a portable. That itself either means that it will > be unsuitable for the system or it will be changed to be made suitable > for the system. Reports make it sound like the latter will be true. You keep throwing around the term unsuitable as if it has any meaning. The fact that it has a battery instead of being slave to the nearest electrical outlet doesn't make it unsuitable. There is NOTHING, other than the size of the screen, that a "full" gaming system brings to the table, that is not also present on a portable of equal power. So anything that's suitable for a full-sized system, that won't suffer from the smaller screen, is suitable on the portable. The portable only has the added advantage of, well, portability. >>> The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it >>> won't be as pretty. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] >the screen, that a "full" gaming system brings to the table, that is not >also present on a portable of equal power. So anything that's suitable for Yes, keep on brushing aside the rather major factor of the size of the screen, as well as the rest of the things that make portables less comfortable to play than consoles. I'm sure that helps your argument. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>> The only difference between having it on the DS and on the PS3 is it >>>> won't be as pretty. [quoted text clipped - 12 lines] >screen, as well as the rest of the things that make portables less >comfortable to play than consoles. I'm sure that helps your argument. I am still trying to figure out why you think CRPGs are unsuited to portable formats when they have a long and successful history there, going back fifteen years or more. The first computer RPG I ever played was Defenders of Oasis on the Game Gear (still have the game and the Game Gear, as a matter of fact). SignatureChristopher Mattern "Which one you figure tracked us?" "The ugly one, sir." "...Could you be more specific?" >I am still trying to figure out why you think CRPGs are unsuited to >portable formats when they have a long and successful history there, >going back fifteen years or more. The first computer RPG I ever There are a number of things that have been received fairly well despite not being suited to their media. Take audiobooks, for example. It's much easier to read a book than it is to listen to one, yet people like audiobooks because you can make use of them while driving a car or doing other things that prohibit reading. But at home, most people would choose the print book over the audiobook. Also note that a big part of the reason why involved games have been on portables for so long is that for a large period of the portable's lifespan, gaming was thought to be exclusively the province of children. These are people with plenty of time on their hands and no money, so the longer a game lasts the better it is for them. And when they run out of games to play on a console (not a farfetched concept for people with no money, especially back in the days of cartridges), they'll start playing portable games whether or not they're at home. I played FFL2 way back in the day a number of times for precisely this reason. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 > >I am still trying to figure out why you think CRPGs are unsuited to > >portable formats when they have a long and successful history there, [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > driving a car or doing other things that prohibit reading. But at > home, most people would choose the print book over the audiobook. Then again, there's something... nice about having someone tell you a story. I especially like it when authors read their own work: Steven King for example does a great job. If it wasn't for the higher price of audio books I'd have many more. SignatureChris Mack "Refugee, total sh.t. That's how I've always seen us. 'Invid Fan' Not a help, you'll admit, to agreement between us." -'Deal/No Deal', CHESS > > There are a number of things that have been received fairly well > > despite not being suited to their media. Take audiobooks, for [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > King for example does a great job. If it wasn't for the higher price of > audio books I'd have many more. I had a much harder time getting through _The Dubliners_ as a print book than I did the audiobook version. Part of the problem was the parts of the book written in dialect, that when spoken were perfectly intelligible. The other was that the book is basically written as a series of rambling tales, the sort of story that makes much more sense when read aloud than when the words sit, dully unresponsive, on the page. -=Eric >> I am still trying to figure out why you think CRPGs are unsuited to >> portable formats when they have a long and successful history there, [quoted text clipped - 17 lines] > played FFL2 way back in the day a number of times for precisely this > reason. Your argument has no logic behind it. It is just a series of meaningless random points that have nearly no bases in facts and strung together by a thin thread of self-righteous indignation and contempt with reality. Farix >>> I am still trying to figure out why you think CRPGs are unsuited to >>> portable formats when they have a long and successful history there, [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] >random points that have nearly no bases in facts and strung together by >a thin thread of self-righteous indignation and contempt with reality. Yes, thank you for your wonderful counterargument. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 > >Your argument has no logic behind it. It is just a series of meaningless > >random points that have nearly no bases in facts and strung together by > >a thin thread of self-righteous indignation and contempt with reality. > > Yes, thank you for your wonderful counterargument. In all fairness, Rob, you'd have to make an argument for his to be a counterargument. Let us know when you plan to make one. -=Eric > Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed > so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly > different from other Dragon Quest games. You shouldn't make dramatic > changes to a numbered series, especially when it's one that has been > notably anti-evolution like DQ has. There already is DQ Rocket Slim on the DS! SignatureAll Purpose Culture Randomness http://www.angelfire.com/tx/apcr/index.html >> Part of the problem is that for a Dragon Quest game to be programmed >> so it will work well on the DS, it would have to be significantly [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >There already is DQ Rocket Slim on the DS! A spinoff. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >>> [quoted text clipped - 6 lines] > styles of games). So, if you want to challenge his authority, you're > going to have to address his argument. And yet he has yet to show why we should care what he thinks about which properties matter, and which don't. Astrobiochemist points out, quite accurately, that there IS room for certain types of games, such as RPGs (which are the very types of games that Rob thinks don't belong on portables) in the DS market. Hell, I enjoyed Lunar, as well as FFT on the GBA. But I guess they don't BELONG there. Yay! I'm a hertic! >>>>> And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? >>>> [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >portables) in the DS market. Hell, I enjoyed Lunar, as well as FFT on the >GBA. But I guess they don't BELONG there. Yay! I'm a hertic! I didn't say you couldn't like them. The two concepts aren't mutually exclusive. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>>>> This recent trend of making games for portables which >>>>>> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > >And your authority is derived from? The differences between the portable and console markets? The differences between portables and consoles themselves? Or maybe just common sense? Take your pick. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 > >>>> No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems that > >>>> they don't belong on. [quoted text clipped - 8 lines] > differences between portables and consoles themselves? Or maybe just > common sense? Take your pick. You've completely and utterly failed to satisfactorily answer the question put to you. You are being asked what "authority" you have to dictate which game belongs on which system. None of the above statements qualifies you as an "authority" on ANYTHING. Your opinion is precisely and ONLY that: YOUR OPINION. Don't presume to dictate your opinion as though it were immutable fact. SignatureI used to have a gay sofa. Now I have a hetero sectional. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ The Eternal Lost Lurker www.lurkerdrome.com "The Eternal Lost Lurker" <kuraebakayarou.lurkerdrome@sbcglobal.net> writes: > You've completely and utterly failed to satisfactorily answer the question > put to you. You are being asked what "authority" you have to dictate which > game belongs on which system. None of the above statements qualifies you as > an "authority" on ANYTHING. > > Your opinion is precisely and ONLY that: YOUR OPINION. It helps to read Rob's posts in a Comic Book Guy voice... -Miles SignatureWe live, as we dream -- alone.... > Your opinion is precisely and ONLY that: YOUR OPINION. Wait a second. When you say that his opinion is just his opinion, isn't that... just your opinion? Why are you presenting it as if it were a fact? (Free hint - "opinion" and "fact" are not mutually exclusive terms). > > Your opinion is precisely and ONLY that: YOUR OPINION. > > Wait a second. When you say that his opinion is just his opinion, isn't > that... just your opinion? Why are you presenting it as if it were a fact? You know...that'd almost work? If it weren't for the fact that it's one of the dumbest f.cking things anyone has ever said in the history of...oh, EVER. SignatureI used to have a gay sofa. Now I have a hetero sectional. ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~ The Eternal Lost Lurker www.lurkerdrome.com >> > Your opinion is precisely and ONLY that: YOUR OPINION. >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >the dumbest f.cking things anyone has ever said in the history of...oh, >EVER. He's just pantomiming you, you know. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >> >>>> No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems that >> >>>> they don't belong on. [quoted text clipped - 13 lines] >game belongs on which system. None of the above statements qualifies you as >an "authority" on ANYTHING. No, but certainly the well-known differences between portables and consoles are authoritative. They are not just my opinion. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>>>>> No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems >>>>>>> that they don't belong on. [quoted text clipped - 16 lines] > No, but certainly the well-known differences between portables and > consoles are authoritative. They are not just my opinion. There are also differences between the PS2 and the Gamecube. Does that mean that games that belong on the PS2 don't belong on the GameCube. You have failed to explain why those differences are SIGNIFICANT in the scope of this discusison. >>>>>>>> No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems >>>>>>>> that they don't belong on. [quoted text clipped - 18 lines] > >There are also differences between the PS2 and the Gamecube. Does that mean Minor differences. I think the biggest one is the size of the media, and that is mostly fixed by putting GC games out on multiple discs. >that games that belong on the PS2 don't belong on the GameCube. You have >failed to explain why those differences are SIGNIFICANT in the scope of this >discusison. No I haven't. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>>>>>>> No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems >>>>>>>> that they don't belong on. [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > GameCube. You have failed to explain why those differences are > SIGNIFICANT in the scope of this discusison. I guess the question is, what makes RPG's a no no for handhelds and exclusivly for home systems and yet, other games aren't. Why are RPG's special and other games for handhelds aren't? Unless you are saying that any game that isn't a port of another game that is on a home system isn't the right kind of game for a handheld. Ryan >>>>>>> This recent trend of making games for portables which >>>>>>> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. [quoted text clipped - 14 lines] > differences between portables and consoles themselves? Or maybe just > common sense? Take your pick. I've found that many appeals to "common sense" are just like "everybody knows." That is to say, an attempt to cover for utter bullshit. There is nothing about a portable gaming system that even remotely suggests that it cannot be a system for serious games. The GBA is at least as powerful as the SNES, which is what I played Chrono Trigger and FF6 on. From what those in this group have said, the DS is as powerful as the PSX, which is where FF7 and Xenogears were released. Hell, I'm currently enjoying replaying Lunar on my GBA. Remember Lunar, commonly considered to be one of the best RPGs made? Other than the size of the system, and the addition of a battery, there is no differene between these classics on their original platform, and on the portable - except that some of them have been updated to become more modern. By the next generation of portables, I should be able to replay Eternal Arcada - which is tied with the first Grandia as my all-time favorite RPG. Not bad for a format that RPGs don't BELONG on. >There is nothing about a portable gaming system that even remotely suggests >that it cannot be a system for serious games. The GBA is at least as I think you're the only one talking about whether or not portable systems can have serious games on them. What I'm talking about is how suited they are to traditional console RPGs and other games that require large amounts of time and effort to accomplish anything in. >Other than the size of the system, and the addition of a battery, there is >no differene between these classics on their original platform, and on the >portable - except that some of them have been updated to become more modern. Yes, and that makes them unsuited to the system. You can still enjoy them, but only because you're willing to handwave the many disadvantages that portables place upon them. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >> There is nothing about a portable gaming system that even remotely >> suggests that it cannot be a system for serious games. The GBA is >> at least as > > I think you're the only one talking about whether or not portable > systems can have serious games on them. What I'm talking about is how I was giving you the benefit of the doubt. Because, other than that, I really can't see anything meaningful in your argument. > suited they are to traditional console RPGs and other games that > require large amounts of time and effort to accomplish anything in. Is there some sort of federal law against putting in large amounts of time and effort on a portable game? >> Other than the size of the system, and the addition of a battery, >> there is no differene between these classics on their original [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > them, but only because you're willing to handwave the many > disadvantages that portables place upon them. WHAT disadvatages? And no, you can't say "it's unsuited" as a disadvantage, and then claim that there are disadvantages to prove that it's unsuited. >>> There is nothing about a portable gaming system that even remotely >>> suggests that it cannot be a system for serious games. The GBA is [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > WHAT disadvatages? And no, you can't say "it's unsuited" as a disadvantage, > and then claim that there are disadvantages to prove that it's unsuited. The only disadvantage I can come up with is the smaller screen. But that is not really much of a disadvantage. Farix >Is there some sort of federal law against putting in large amounts of time >and effort on a portable game? What would that have to do with my argument? >>> Other than the size of the system, and the addition of a battery, >>> there is no differene between these classics on their original [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >WHAT disadvatages? And no, you can't say "it's unsuited" as a disadvantage, >and then claim that there are disadvantages to prove that it's unsuited. I really should just tell you to read my earlier posts again, but I'll be nice and do some copypasta: "What's the point of playing something with a tiny screen and an unergonomic design at home when a console or PC is much more comfortable? "Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from playing with larger, more powerful devices. Because of this, portable games are supposed to be quick to play and enjoy during the time you spend on the subway or a ten-minute coffee break." "Sorry, but it's physically impossible to make a system that's both portable enough to fit well in a pocket and at the same time is as comfortable to manipulate as a console controller or keyboard/mouse setup or as easy on the eyes as a moderately sized TV or monitor. I've tried the DS and it doesn't break those rules." "What makes you think I'm talking about the location? That's only one part of the comfort equation, and a relatively minor one at that. If I have to hunch over the thing and contort my hands to play it, it doesn't matter if I'm in a frigging meadow; it's still not going to be comfortable." ">But that's nothing that a save file can't fix. "It is if you don't allow the player to save where ever he wants, which is the case with console RPGs. And besides that, save files still don't fix the problem of not feeling like you've accomplished anything after your ten minutes of play. Not many console RPGs can give you that sense of accomplishment in that short amount of time." Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 > "What's the point of playing something with a tiny screen and an > unergonomic design at home when a console or PC is much more > comfortable? I disagree that the design is unergonomic, or that playing on a console or PC is necessarily much more comfortable. I tend to play my wife's GBA sitting on the same couch as when I play the PS2, and I'm not more or less comfortable playing either. > "Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from > playing with larger, more powerful devices. That is simply not true. > Because of this, portable games are supposed to be quick to play > and enjoy during the time you spend on the subway or a ten-minute > coffee break." That is an opinion, not a fact. > "Sorry, but it's physically impossible to make a system that's both > portable enough to fit well in a pocket and at the same time is as > comfortable to manipulate as a console controller or keyboard/mouse > setup or as easy on the eyes as a moderately sized TV or monitor. I've > tried the DS and it doesn't break those rules." It doesn't for you. Which makes your opinion no less valid, but it does not make it any more fact. > If I have to hunch over the thing and contort my hands to play it, > it doesn't matter if I'm in a frigging meadow; it's still not going > to be comfortable." Then you're holding it wrong, or it's just not a good fit for you. That doesn't make it any more of a fact for anyone; it just means that your opinion is based on your experience. Others have different experiences. > "It is if you don't allow the player to save where ever he wants, > which is the case with console RPGs. So, uh, gosh, maybe that will change for portable RPGs. Big whoop. > And besides that, save files still don't fix the problem of not > feeling like you've accomplished anything after your ten minutes of > play. Others have posted disagreeing with this point, so it's clearly not fact. > Not many console RPGs can give you that sense of accomplishment in > that short amount of time." Apparently FF3 can, and DS9 is likely to (based on the developers not being morons). -=Eric > I really should just tell you to read my earlier posts again, but I'll > be nice and do some copypasta: > > "What's the point of playing something with a tiny screen and an > unergonomic design at home when a console or PC is much more > comfortable? How is a console more comfortable? I can play my PSP on the sofa, or in bed. Every console game I've played required you to sit in front of the TV, looking up at it. I suppose that you could play on the couch, if it was 2 feet from the TV. Funny, I've never lived in a house with that setup. > "Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from > playing with larger, more powerful devices. Because of this, portable > games are supposed to be quick to play and enjoy during the time you > spend on the subway or a ten-minute coffee break." What about Pokemon? It's been around on portables for over a decade. > "Sorry, but it's physically impossible to make a system that's both > portable enough to fit well in a pocket and at the same time is as > comfortable to manipulate as a console controller or keyboard/mouse > setup or as easy on the eyes as a moderately sized TV or monitor. I've > tried the DS and it doesn't break those rules." OK. I'll give you that the controls on the portable aren't as good as a console or computer. But it's pretty close to a console. Both are blown away by a mouse/keyboard, and a TV (even HDTV) sucks compared to a computer monitor. So, if you're not going to play a RPG on a computer, like God intended, does it really matter what lesser machine you use? > "What makes you think I'm talking about the location? That's only one > part of the comfort equation, and a relatively minor one at that. If > I have to hunch over the thing and contort my hands to play it, it > doesn't matter if I'm in a frigging meadow; it's still not going to be > comfortable." I don't hunch over my PSP. > ">But that's nothing that a save file can't fix. > > "It is if you don't allow the player to save where ever he wants, > which is the case with console RPGs. It's simple. Shut it off when you're done. Turn it on when you want to play again. You really only need save games for when you want to do something else with it. > And besides that, save files > still don't fix the problem of not feeling like you've accomplished > anything after your ten minutes of play. Not many console RPGs can > give you that sense of accomplishment in that short amount of time." What about daily commutes? SignatureMike Swaim swaim@hal-pc.org at home | Quote: "Boingie"^4 Y,W & D MD Anderson Division of Quantitative Sciences mpswaim@mdanderson.org or mswaim@odin.mdacc.tmc.edu at work ICBM: 29.763N 95.363W|Disclaimer: Yeah, like I speak for MD Anderson. >> I really should just tell you to read my earlier posts again, but I'll >> be nice and do some copypasta: [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] >How is a console more comfortable? I can play my PSP on the sofa, or in >bed. Every console game I've played required you to sit in front of the I can play my PS2 in the same situations. >TV, looking up at it. I suppose that you could play on the couch, if it >was 2 feet from the TV. Funny, I've never lived in a house with that >setup. Two feet away? Are you blind or do you just have a 12" TV? >> "Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from >> playing with larger, more powerful devices. Because of this, portable >> games are supposed to be quick to play and enjoy during the time you >> spend on the subway or a ten-minute coffee break." > >What about Pokemon? It's been around on portables for over a decade. Explained that in an earlier post. It's a special case because it's based around sharing monsters with other players, which would've been a lot harder to do on consoles, especially at that time. >> "Sorry, but it's physically impossible to make a system that's both >> portable enough to fit well in a pocket and at the same time is as [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] >computer monitor. So, if you're not going to play a RPG on a computer, >like God intended, does it really matter what lesser machine you use? The keyboard/mouse setup certainly doesn't "blow away" console controllers in every situation. Try playing a fighting game on a PC without a gamepad, for example. Console RPGs are also made for console controllers, and most people don't have those connected to their computers. And TVs beat out computer monitors based on size, so their output advantages and disadvantages cancel each other out. >> ">But that's nothing that a save file can't fix. >> [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] >play again. You really only need save games for when you want to do >something else with it. Assuming you're talking about a sleep mode of some kind, that would change the flow of the game, thus making it something decidedly different from a traditional console RPG. >> And besides that, save files >> still don't fix the problem of not feeling like you've accomplished >> anything after your ten minutes of play. Not many console RPGs can >> give you that sense of accomplishment in that short amount of time." > > What about daily commutes? Those are still short amounts of time split up by day, unless you're one of those unfortunates with horrible hour-long commute times. Over time you'll likely get somewhere in the game, but since you've only been playing it off-and-on over a few days, it won't feel like much of an accomplishment. Rob ploovTeHSPaeMBLoKuR@charter.net SignatureOwner of 2501 Netstalker Points awarded by Corwin of Amber, mainly because Atma's just too damn attractive to get away from. Gave 7499 Netstalker Points to Cypher because there's no such thing as a good day on AGFF without JT bashing! Owner of David Watson, rec.arts.anime.misc "Some people are more passionate about preserving foreskin than they are about the environment, human life, and a million other subjects. If you're going to have an obsession, at least get a good one, like Tetris or that girl that said no when she really meant yes." --Josh "Livestock" Boruff, Something Awful ALoD 10-11-06 >>> I really should just tell you to read my earlier posts again, but >>> I'll be nice and do some copypasta: [quoted text clipped - 58 lines] > change the flow of the game, thus making it something decidedly > different from a traditional console RPG. In what way does it change the flow of the game? Hell, when I play any RPG on my ps2 I normally don't play for more than an hour at a time anyway. Most times even less. Ryan >> There is nothing about a portable gaming system that even remotely >> suggests that it cannot be a system for serious games. The GBA is [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > suited they are to traditional console RPGs and other games that > require large amounts of time and effort to accomplish anything in. But if you can save at any point in the game, that point is moot. >> Other than the size of the system, and the addition of a battery, >> there is no differene between these classics on their original [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > them, but only because you're willing to handwave the many > disadvantages that portables place upon them. What the f.ck happened to this place this last year? Ryan >>>> This recent trend of making games for portables which >>>> don't fit with this philosophy annoys the hell out of me. [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > And how do we know what BELONGS on which system? Die, monster! You don't BELONG in this DS! (Yeah, couldn't resist :P) SignatureJorge A Pratt > >Yeah, it sucks when people make you buy games you don't want to play. > > No, it sucks when people put games I want to play on systems that they > don't belong on. Oh, I'm sorry, I missed the press release where you were crowned King Of Which Games Go On Which Consoles. Just a sec, I'll check Reuters... -=Eric >>>In article >>><ZPXfh.485326$QZ1.343061@bgtnsc04-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Ethan >>>Hammond <eshammond@worldnet.att.net> wrote: <snip> >>>Ah, well. The only place I have to play games is at home, so a portable >>>is rather pointless. Guess I'll miss out on all the good games for now [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >What's the point of playing something with a tiny screen That tiny screen is plenty viewable when it's only 2 feet away from your eyes. (Well, okay, maybe my GB micro IS a little small for comfort...) > and an unergonomic design at home when a Woo. Tried one lately? Nintendo and friends have been spending serious dollars on ergonomics. I'd argue that the video game industry on the whole score better on ergonomics than almost any other industry. Certainly better than big box PC retailers. >console or PC is much more comfortable? Debateable. If your PC is in a good location, and as you say, you pay good attention to the ergonomics, then yeah, it could be. But barring a Notebook, your PC or Console is where you put it. Your portable is where you put YOU. Wanna game in the kitchen? How about sitting in the sunroom? Back porch? In the bedroom? On the can? >Portables were meant to be played when circumstances keep people from >playing with larger, more powerful devices. In your mind perhaps. I've always considered portable devices to be ideal for playing what I want, where I want, when I want. >Because of this, portable >games are supposed to be quick to play and enjoy during the time you >spend on the subway or a ten-minute coffee break. To a lesser extent I agree with you. Some games are a little bit time consuming, which might hurt their viability on a portable platform. But that's nothing that a save file can't fix. I've been working on Lunar Legend on the GBA for the better part of three years now. It just sits in the micro, and if I have time while I'm in line, or waiting for dinner to show up, I flip the switch and play another screen or two. >This recent trend >of making games for portables which don't fit with this philosophy >annoys the hell out of me. Mostly agreed. I'd amend that by saying that games made for portables, without making consessions to the platform limitations are annoying. If a game is going to take longer than your typical "portable" session, it needs to have a save state. Really the only reason I can think of not to make a game portable is if it needs more screen real estate than is offered on a portable platform. In those cases, I'd totally agree; you're right, it shouldn't be there. But I've yet to run across anything of this sort. -- "Lyrical Tokarev! Kill them All!" - Touge Chan Abraham Evangelista >> and an unergonomic design at home when a > >Woo. Tried one lately? Nintendo and friends have been spending >serious dollars on ergonomics. I'd argue that the video game industry >on the whole score better on ergonomics than almost any other >industry. Certainly better than big box PC retailers. Sorry, but it's physically impossible to make a system that's both portable enough to fit well in a pocket and at the same time is as comfortable to manipulate as a console controller or keyboard/mouse setup or as easy on the eyes as a moderately sized TV or monitor. I've tried the DS and it doesn't break those rules. >But barring a Notebook, your PC or Console is where you put it. Your >portable is where you put YOU. Wanna game in the kitchen? How about >sitting in the sunroom? Back porch? In the bedroom? On the can? What makes you think I'm talking about the location? That's only one part of the comfort equation, and a relatively minor one at that. If I have to hunch over the thing and contort my hands to play it, it doesn't matter if I'm in a frigging meadow; it's still not going to be< |
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