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Shaman Mage duo

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Lance Berg - 30 Oct 2003 03:21 GMT
OK, so I started my mage with the plan to duo up with my shaman
friend, but the sword selling season got to me, and my employee's
didn't show up to help make weapons near as much as I'd planned,
so our play schedules didn't sync up much.  I Plowed thru levels
when I could, and with her baby back from the premie ward her
play rate dropped down to near nonexistant for  awhile, so we've
been wildly different levels.  

Her play rate went up while mine went down, though, so she's
catching up fast, now at 36 to my 40, we are definately in range
of each otehr, in fact we went on an LDoN run a couple days back,
recruiting the rest of a group to come with us.

So, initially I thought this would really rock as a duo; my pet
plus nukes, her haste and buffs and slow.  Then I decided I'd
been a fool to think that, I have my own pet only haste and rely
on DS to do a fair amount of my damage output, slow wouldn't
really complement that style.

But that was in our 20s; as we level up things seem to be
changing again, just in time for us to finally get some real duo
play time.  Haste is a pain to maintain, her not having to haste
my pet isn't a bad thing really.  She's got her own pet now, and
if both our pets are fighting then mine can easily hold aggro off
hers, which means we can both heal him as needed.  I'm also using
my fire pet now, with her HP buffs and even her relatively sucky
AC buff he's a lot more survivable as a main tank, and his DS is
much better than my cast one plus costs us no mana.

SOW, well what can I say, SOW is an immense boost to my
survivability and to pulling.  I can Expedience my pet, but not
myself, so thats an enormous benefit when I get unwanted aggro or
when I -want- aggro to hate kite with.  

Funniest thing is that she can end up going thru a lot more mana
than I do on some pulls... in which case I can supplement her
regen with bandaging.  I need to catch that skill up, its only 75
or so at the moment, hasn't been useful since I generally need to
be sitting for mana regen.  If we can swing a mount, though, that
will go up markedly... and it would help if I could get the skill
up to make it even more so.

Shaman also gives me something else important; root.  Plus she
literally triples our tanking ability; shaman plus pet plus my
pet can all tank mobs if they have to... as a mage, I sure can't,
haven't been able to since about 10th level honestly.  Between
root parking and off tanking, adds aren't nearly the concern
(read "death warrant") that they are to me solo.

Thats all stuff she can do for me, though, what about me for
her?  Well, my pet is a better tank than either she -or- her pet,
and that will be more true as we level up.  While my shaman waded
in and melee'd just to let the pet live long enough to kill the
mob, she can hang back and cannidance (at least till we get that
mount).  Plus I supply a DS, either via fire pet or cast if I
have to, and cut her need to haste to a third (haste my own pet
plus she's not tanking so no haste for her), and I have pretty
good damage output on my own, dropping a few nukes in per mob
depending on our pull speed.  And there's the gear, she's lacking
most focus items, I can fill a few of those gaps at least, and
put her pet in plate armor and give him weapons to activate dual
weild (haven't tested that out actually, when does shaman pet get
dual weild anyway?)

I still think the duo is a bit lacking compared to some, but its
not bad.  And the fact that we've been working together thru
three different sets of characters (druid/cleric, monk/bard,
paladin/enchanter) means that we're very accustomed to trying
things out and making things up on the fly, trying to learn the
intricacies of a given pairing or how we can work as core of a
group.

More later after we've tried it out further

Splendid One, 40 Gnomage, Firiona Vie
Steven \(Silverblade\) - 30 Oct 2003 11:21 GMT
Actually, mage/shaman is one of THE best combos in the game, seriously :)

Ok shamna's lack the ability to fast kill, folk always go on about how
shaman can do mobs almost no one else can...which is true but they takes
AGES ot kill them.
Mages are the masters of the slam bam kill low blues like chopping logs
technique.
Shamns add crowd control to a mage (the class with the least CC).
Mages add superb DPs to a shaman (the class with the lowest DPs)
Mages have a port-a-tank and jsu tabout any item you need form armour,
weapons, foucs, pet toys.
Shmans can buff crap out of tanks (pets) and heal.

used to duo with shaman pals in every zone near enough, and trioed in
elementals.
So it is a superb combo!

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> OK, so I started my mage with the plan to duo up with my shaman
> friend, but the sword selling season got to me, and my employee's
[quoted text clipped - 71 lines]
>
> Splendid One, 40 Gnomage, Firiona Vie
Frank E - 30 Oct 2003 17:51 GMT
>Shaman also gives me something else important; root.  Plus she
>literally triples our tanking ability; shaman plus pet plus my
>pet can all tank mobs if they have to... as a mage, I sure can't,
>haven't been able to since about 10th level honestly.  Between
>root parking and off tanking, adds aren't nearly the concern
>(read "death warrant") that they are to me solo.

You left out str and dex buffs (HoS/Focus at higher levels). A good
str buff with noticeably up the average damage of a pet if you parse
it and dex is always good for pets if they have proccing weapons.

>Thats all stuff she can do for me, though, what about me for
>her?  Well, my pet is a better tank than either she -or- her pet,
[quoted text clipped - 10 lines]
>weild (haven't tested that out actually, when does shaman pet get
>dual weild anyway?)

All the pets have a chance to dual wield but it doesn't happen very
often with the low level ones.  High level pets, a pair of good
procing weapons will upgrade Puppup's DPS by around 50%.

Another nice thing about a mage partner is haveing someone to mal-x.
Mage can do that on incoming w/o getting agro and the shaman can slow
faster.

>I still think the duo is a bit lacking compared to some, but its
>not bad.

Only thing I really miss in that duo is lack of snare and pulling
skills (No FD, pacify, harmony)  ...that, and the annoyance of trying
to keep the mob on the mage pet instead of the shaman's.

Overall though, it's argueably the best duo out there for straight up
fights. At the high end, you can duo summoning, unfearable mobs that
I'd be very hesitant to try with any other duo. Mage/shaman combines
the best offensive and the best defensive class in the game and should
serve you well however long you want to duo.

Rgds, Frank
Lance Berg - 30 Oct 2003 18:54 GMT
> >Shaman also gives me something else important; root.  Plus she
> >literally triples our tanking ability; shaman plus pet plus my
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
> str buff with noticeably up the average damage of a pet if you parse
> it and dex is always good for pets if they have proccing weapons.

Haven't been doing the stat buffs so far, but will look at it for
str.  So far I don't have proccing summon weapons unless we are
beating up summoned mobs, and I can't think of any we can take on
at our level (36-41).

> Another nice thing about a mage partner is haveing someone to mal-x.
> Mage can do that on incoming w/o getting agro and the shaman can slow
> faster.

Thats a good thought, so far she doesn't need mal-x to land slow
but I recall that changing with my shaman in his 40s, pretty much
had to malaise every single mob.  COurse I used to use it to pull
with, what would she pull with if not that... cancel magic?  My
mage is pulling with that now when he pulls, but either of us
could malaise pull instead if the resist debuff is in order.

> >I still think the duo is a bit lacking compared to some, but its
> >not bad.
>
> Only thing I really miss in that duo is lack of snare and pulling
> skills (No FD, pacify, harmony)  ...that, and the annoyance of trying
> to keep the mob on the mage pet instead of the shaman's.

I've found this part remarkably easy.  Shaman tells /pet no
taunt. Problem solved.  She was literally unaware such an option
existed... but then she's only been a pet class for a couple
levels, and her stint as a 65 druid didn't leave her with a lot
of pet skills either, as that druid pet is pretty much only good
for laughs; my cleric pet could take it two falls out of three.

Since shaman pets don't have any spells and tend to do less
damage than comperable level mage pets (not much less by my
unofficial "stand near them and watch the hit messages" parse) I
wouldnt' think that there would be much to worry about in the
future either.

Splendid
Frank E - 30 Oct 2003 23:11 GMT
>Haven't been doing the stat buffs so far, but will look at it for
>str.  So far I don't have proccing summon weapons unless we are
>beating up summoned mobs, and I can't think of any we can take on
>at our level (36-41).

Yeah, dex doesn't really come into play unti 61(?) when you get the
fists. But a dual wielding, hasted, focused air pet with Ferine Avatar
is something to behold. I remember running a parse on my pet DPS at
around 50th lvl with str and it was over a 5% increase, since str
buffs are cheap is usually worth keeping up imo.

>> Another nice thing about a mage partner is haveing someone to mal-x.
>> Mage can do that on incoming w/o getting agro and the shaman can slow
[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>mage is pulling with that now when he pulls, but either of us
>could malaise pull instead if the resist debuff is in order.

Yeah, if the shaman is pulling, you're usually better off just pulling
with Mal-x. It's something I'd always cast (over around 40th lvl) if I
was soloing or doing with a caster (other than an enchanter). And
really, shaman is pretty much always gonna be the top choice for
puller in your duo since she can get an overpull undercontrol before
she ever gets back to camp. I'd also recommend getting her the booties
if you haven't already, you two can duo everything up to Dire, and
your cleric can always solo him for her.

>> >I still think the duo is a bit lacking compared to some, but its
>> >not bad.
[quoted text clipped - 5 lines]
>I've found this part remarkably easy.  Shaman tells /pet no
>taunt. Problem solved.
Yeah, probably more a matter of teaching 'em not to use that damn
earth pet! :p

Rgds, Frank
Lance Berg - 31 Oct 2003 01:08 GMT
> On Thu, 30 Oct 2003 17:54:16 GMT, Lance Berg <emporer@dejazzd.com>

> Yeah, if the shaman is pulling, you're usually better off just pulling
> with Mal-x. It's something I'd always cast (over around 40th lvl) if I
[quoted text clipped - 4 lines]
> if you haven't already, you two can duo everything up to Dire, and
> your cleric can always solo him for her.

Sadly, since the cleric is on Morel Thule (along with the 57 bard
and the 52 shaman, any one of whom could probably get the dire
wolf taken care of solo... did it with the cleric when the shaman
was 35 or so)  he won't be much help getting stuff on Firiona
Vie.  

I did love those boots though, and as you say, everything thru
the Mistmore part we can do ourselves, will only have to figure
out how to get some real power together to do that run to the
library and then the wolf.

Splendid One, 41 Gnomage, Firiona Vie
 
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