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Game Forum / Role Playing Games / Diablo / February 2006Conviction and Pig Lords in Uber-Tristram, Do the Math
The Pig Lords are listed as 145% resistant for their 5 immunities. Louis' pally after mepf croaked was runnign around qwith conviction, I forget what level, let's assume 20. Surely the conviction helped in thebattle with any non-immunes. The Pig Lords still had all their immunites listed despite the Conviction in place. I had seen something like also take place in a regular Hell game with my own pally, where with Conviction running, sometimes I ran into an immune creature and the immunity still appeared. So given that they are minions, is it possible that the Conviction get reduced by some percentage. Kaytie mentioned something like this which related to a super-unique Colenzo in throneroom. Level 20 Conviciton is what, 125% effetive under normal circumstances. If a 20% reduction pertains because of the Pig Lords being treated extra special then this drops it 25% and 145% - 25% = 120%, therefore still immune. This means that one needs 45 X 5 = 225% to produce an effective reduction of 45%. This will bring it to 100%, which still does not break the immunity, therefore this means that one needs Conviction higher than level 40 for any kind of damage to actualy take place. Does this sound right? Well the Math is fine, it's the assumptions that need to be verified. So the other minions, does this mean that their resistance is also cut by only 25% with level 20 Conviction in uber tristram. This really does make the whole thing more challenging. Orion > The Pig Lords are listed as 145% resistant for their 5 immunities. > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Does this sound right? Well the Math is fine, it's the assumptions that > need to be verified. It means you can't break them as Conviction caps out at 150%. It could be level 99 and still only be 150%. The highest I've ever got a necro's LR to is -65%, so even then you couldn't break them with conviction and LR. Conviction craps out at 150%? Oh wait - "caps" out. he he Ahh I see. yeah now I remember reading that in another thread. Well it should then help the other minions go down faster at least. The necro's LR, will that also be only 20% effective, like the Conviction? Funny that puts 150 = 65 = 215. It's like they did that on purpose. Even if you have yet another item with "lowers target resist", it would have to be higher than 50% to get you past the other 10%. Sneaky Blizzard designers. Well it did add to the excitement. Orion > Conviction craps out at 150%? > [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > with "lowers target resist", it would have to be higher than 50% to get > you past the other 10%. Actually, as Mark (I think) said, it is ONLY Conviction and Lower Resists which can break or help to break a monster's immunity. The "- enemy resist" only works once the immunity has been broken, although it will wowrk at full strength. And yes, I think Blizzard purposely made the immunobeasts (tm) unbreakably immune. > The Pig Lords are listed as 145% resistant for their 5 immunities. > [quoted text clipped - 30 lines] > > This really does make the whole thing more challenging. Nice maath, but incorrect :) Conviction is only at the 20% effectiveness if it BREAKS the immunity. The same is true of lower resits. Secondly LR does not cap, but begins to gain 1% LR for every 2 skill points. Maxing it out with high end items can procude over 70%. I would bet that with a maxed out PR and a maxed out conviction, you could break their immunity, but they would still have an 80% resitance. Mickey <snip> > Conviction is only at the 20% effectiveness if it BREAKS the immunity. > The same is true of lower resits. Secondly LR does not cap, but begins > to gain 1% LR for every 2 skill points. Maxing it out with high end > items can procude over 70%. I would bet that with a maxed out PR and a > maxed out conviction, you could break their immunity, but they would > still have an 80% resitance. Mickey are you sure about LR. I thought it capped at 70% at slvl 60, at least that's what the skill calculator I use tells me. I'm not going to ask how you would get it over 60 anyway. If I'm right (which admittedly is very rare), with a maxed out Conviction and LR, you could only get -44 resists to an immune monster. Compare that to the figure of 145 and well, I think it means they meant to make them unbreakably immune. chaliban what about: 1) Merc has infinity and wearing grif (unique help with lower light resistances) and 4 socket armor with 4 5/5 facets that reduce lightning resist. 2( You have grif helm also and infinity, low resists wand. 3) Pally in party has aura that lowers resists Top Post: OK, this has been done many times but only Conviction and Lower Resists will break an immunity. All other effects do not have any effect on breaking an immunity. The numbers posted previously are pretty much the maximum levels possible for Conviction and Lower Resists. > what about: > > 1) Merc has infinity and wearing grif (unique help with lower > light resistances) and 4 socket armor with 4 5/5 facets that > reduce lightning resist. Merc has infinity is only lvl 13 (?) Conviction compared to Pally level 25 for max lower resist effect. Facets and other items such as Griffon will not effect the immunity. > 2( You have grif helm also and infinity, low resists wand. Only one conviction aura can effect a monster at any time. See above re Griffon > 3) Pally in party has aura that lowers resists See above. > Top Post: > [quoted text clipped - 21 lines] > > See above. Yes it is sad but true. And we figured that prttye much max resist from conviction AND Lower Resist coupled together will not break 145% resist on those minions. Again I say it sounds like Blizzard is the one that did the math to make sure that it would not be broken. 45% x 5 = 225 lower resist needed jsut to get it too 100 and actually need to go below 100 and even if you do they still have such high resist that the damage will be minimal. Need physical agasinst those suckers. which makes it even mroe exciting in Furnacce of Pain. Sam Kinison has Berzerk turned on in there. last nights run, the talk went like this. Party member: IM, beware! SamKinison: Berzerk, beware! (meaning monsters beware) Ans Sam berzerked their sorry a.s (OKs) with an IK maul and war cry stunned them and pendraig got in on the fun with some super zeal. anyways in UT swinging at those things without IM around seems pretty useless for some. sam just howled them away and then when the uber(s) went down we tackled them then. The pussies are howled away like the smallest slighest devilkin. OH! OH! OH! Orion > > Top Post: > > [quoted text clipped - 54 lines] > > OH! OH! OH! Since discovering that my pally has a ranged and yet physical attack, IM is no longer of concern to me, I mash the Furnace without even slowing down. Mickey > The Pig Lords are listed as 145% resistant for their 5 immunities. [SNIP] > Does this sound right? Monsters that are 'immune' can have their immunity 'broken' by Lower Resist and Conviction for elemental resistances, and Amplify Damage and Decrepify for physical resistances. Immunity is a resistance of 100% or greater. When breaking an immunity the above listed skills operate at 20% effectiveness (1/5). So level 20 Conviction that normally reduces elemental resistance by 125% will only reduce an immune monster's resistance by 25%. So if a monster was immune to fire, for example, with 125% FR L20 Conviction would reduce its immunity to 100%. Which would mean they are still immune. If on the other hand their fire immunity was due to 100% fire resist, the Conviction would lower this to 75%, thus breaking the immunity. Note that the 20% effectiveness for breaking an immunity applies throughout the reduction, not just to the component that brings it below 100%. > So the other minions, does this mean that their resistance is also cut > by only 25% with level 20 Conviction in uber tristram. Non-immunes have resistance reducing skills applied normally, at full strength. Regards- Mark Bongo Fury > > The Pig Lords are listed as 145% resistant for their 5 immunities. > [SNIP] [quoted text clipped - 23 lines] > > Bongo Fury Dang ... I wish this had come up before I built a Convicting Avenger to see how'd he do in UT. Well, he's lev82 now so I'll run him just to watch the carnage. Robert |
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