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Game Forum / Nintendo / GameCube / May 2007laughing my f.cking a.s off!! - Ken Kutaragi to Work with Sony on PlayStation 4, PlayStation5 and PlayStation6
http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html Kutaragi to Work with Sony on PS4, 5, 6 Although he is moving on, the father of PlayStation will still be aiding the system's development. by Daemon Hatfield April 30, 2007 - In an interview with EE Times, outgoing Sony executive Ken Kutaragi has revealed plans to continue working with Sony on the PlayStation 4, 5, and 6. The PS3 should also be well taken care of, as Kutaragi has already planned out the console's design changes and cost-reducing measures over the next couple years. The next step for the system is to further develop the PlayStation Network. "As a matter of course, I have the vision of PlayStation 4, 5, and 6, which will merge into the network," Kutaragi says. Ken Kutaragi The father of the PlayStation was waiting until the PS3 was released in Europe to start talking about future versions of the console. "We've introduced PS3 in Europe, so now I can openly talk about" future plans, he said. Sony announced last week that Kutaragi would be stepping down from his position as President and Group COO of Sony Computer Entertainment on June 19. Although he will be primarily focused on independent projects, he will maintain a professional relationship with Sony. "Now I'm ready to start working with a much wider world," Kutaragi tells EE Times. _______________________________________________________________ http://www.eetimes.com/news/latest/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=199202196 Exclusive: Outgoing Sony exec Kutaragi already planning PS4 Yoshiko Hara EE Times (04/27/2007 12:30 PM EDT) TOKYO - Playstation inventor Ken Kutaragi, who will retire as chairman and group CEO of Sony Computer Entertainment Inc. on June 19, is already thinking ahead to Playstation 4 and beyond. In an exclusive interview with EE Times, Kutaragi said: "As a matter of course, I have the vision of Playstation 4, 5 and 6, which will merge into the network." Thursday's (April 26) announcement of Kutaragi's "graduation" from SCEI was widely viewed here and across the consumer electronics industry with surprise. Kutaragi said he proposed his resignation to Sony's board of directors on Thursday. Kutaragi said he previously turned over to Sony's PS3 design team his vision for reducing costs along with design models extending about two years into the future. "Now I'm ready to start working with a much wider world," Kutaragi said. The outgoing Sony executive said he will maintain an amicable relationship with Sony, but added that future projects will be largely independent of Sony. >From its inception, Kutaragi said he had a vision for the Playstation franchise. The roadmap that led to PS3 was always clear in his mind, he said. But when introduction of PS3 was delayed by a blue-violet laser shortage, "I could not talk about the next step. We've introduced PS3 in Europe, so now I can openly talk about" future plans, he said. Creating a new world on the network is the next challenge Kutaragi has in mind, following the desgin and development of computer entertainment on the Playstation. "The design concept of the Cell processor is the network processor," he stressed. When the PS3 was introduced last year, Kutaragi said the network environment was not ready for a net-based game console. "Now it has become possible, so why not enter?" he said. ____________________________________________________________________________ I don't think there will be a PS5 or PS6. I think Sony will give it one more shot with PS4. unless PS4 is a huge success, it will be the end of SCEI. Sony will have no choice but to kill their games division. Xbox 360, Wii and their successor will be ruling the videogame industry. Sony is being ousted. > http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html > [quoted text clipped - 74 lines] > > "Now it has become possible, so why not enter?" he said. ____________________________________________________________________________ > I don't think there will be a PS5 or PS6. I think Sony will give it > one more shot with PS4. unless PS4 is a huge success, it will be the > end of SCEI. Sony will have no choice but to kill their games > division. Xbox 360, Wii and their successor will be ruling the > videogame industry. Sony is being ousted. Sony's game division was one of the only things keeping the entire company profitable just a few years ago, so I doubt they will kill it off so quickly. If the PS3 "flops" (which is way too early to call), that means they had one bad product following the two most successful consoles in history. It isn't their "third strike." Don't forget that MS lost money on the Xbox and hasn't yet made money on the Xbox 360 either. While the company has enough money to continue supporting a losing division from now until eternity, they will eventually have to answer to shareholders. If 360 doesn't become profitable, I think it is MS, not Sony, that may try only one more time before exiting the games industry. Since Nintendo does nothing else--no computer operating systems, no televisions, etc.--they'll remain in it to the end. Even though the Wii is still selling like hotcakes, they are nowhere near the level of success they once had when they ruled the industry. There is still plenty of time for them to blow their lead with the Wii, but even if they get out of console manufacturing, I can see them still releasing handheld systems and software for other platforms. >> http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html > ____________________________________________________________________________ [quoted text clipped - 25 lines] > even if they get out of console manufacturing, I can see them still > releasing handheld systems and software for other platforms. I think with Sony they're trying to put too many eggs into one basket. I mean, what would be the next addon to be placed within the next generation of Playstation? Popcorn machine, soda machine or a microwave? I still say they really messed up putting in blu-ray into the PS3 and keeping costs high. Okay, it makes it the cheapest blu-ray player out on the market but it's made it the most expensive console out right now and possibly outpriced it for a lot of people at the moment until they can save up and even then, some may not wish to fork out that much money. Microsoft is doing okay, much better this time around and are in 2nd place at the moment, same as with the first generation they came in with the xbox. The only problem they have is getting into the Japan market. But Microsoft needs certain games to get those over there to buy into the system. They don't have what Sony had and they don't have the monster franchise that is Pokemon that Nintendo has. Trust me, it's much bigger than Digimon/Monster Rancher although those two did do PS1/2 well in Japan as well. As for Sony with PS4, it depends if PS3 will remain in 3rd place or if it can gain 2nd place against the 360 which is it up against. The Wii is in a different market altogether and is doing well being in 1st at the moment. However, games industry is big business and it doesn't matter if a machine doesn't have high definition or a 25-50gb disc format, they will go to whichever machine has sold more units for greater game sellage which is the 360 and Wii at this time. The other thing to keep an eye on is whether if the PS3 ends up selling like the N64 for being too costly, not enough games support etc, will the 3rd parties bother much with the PS4 and give it the Gamecube treatment? Sony may not see any rewards until the PS5 if they do something radical and different to get back into the game. I suppose the Wii was going to be Nintendo's third strike sortof. But having profit on the Gamecube sales, no matter how small they were selling in numbers did keep Nintendo in the game. They can't lose out on money from each console sold. Not that I'm saying that Sony and Microsoft are wrong in selling a machine and losing money. But I think Sony doesn't have the same mountain of money that Microsoft has in doing this and that they can't do this for two generations. I suppose Microsoft next time around could up the specs a lot more, sell at a loss and hope to go for Sony's throat. I haven't a clue and it's much too early to discuss about PS4, xbox480/4D? or Wii2 anyways. :) Me, I buy a PS3 if it had the games which it doesn't at the moment and it if got down to the £250 mark. Perhaps releasing the 20gb version in Europe may have helped some problems of not selling enough units, etc. But I can see a price cut within 12 months if sales don't rise. Maybe just in time for Christmas as it will be the true first Xmas year to see which console wins out on sales. However, still say Microsoft needs to buy a Japanese developer or two and make a franchise that will get the 360 selling over there. That's all that they have lacking at the moment, they do need to sort out whatever problem they do have in that territory.  SignatureSkipai On May 1, 5:45 am, "Skipai Otter" <skipaiot...@fishbones.hotmail.com> wrote: The Wii is in a > different market altogether and is doing well being in 1st at the moment. Xbox 360 is still in 1st place, worldwide, even though Wii is rapidly catching up. In microsoft.public.xbox Skipai Otter <skipaiotter@fishbones.hotmail.com> wrote: > I think with Sony they're trying to put too many eggs into one basket. I > mean, what would be the next addon to be placed within the next generation [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > it for a lot of people at the moment until they can save up and even then, > some may not wish to fork out that much money. Well, we already know what the PS9 is going to look like... I suspect that the PS4 will introduce a pscyho-helmet of some sort so you can start controlling games with your brain. The PS5 will introduce rumble to the pscyho-helmet ;) PS6 will have an optional surgical package allowing you to get some rudimentary tactile and olfactory feedback with your games along with direct access to your optical and audio(?) nerves. PS7 will will require a fully functional cyberjack. PS8 will allow players to insert their entire consciousness into the game. And finally, the PS9 replaces the now bulky and obsolete cyberjack with fully networked nano-probes, that simply requires the player to sniff to enjoy. ("man i was up all night yesterday snorting GTA26!") > Microsoft is doing okay, much better this time around and are in 2nd place > at the moment, same as with the first generation they came in with the xbox. [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > Pokemon that Nintendo has. Trust me, it's much bigger than Digimon/Monster > Rancher although those two did do PS1/2 well in Japan as well. 2nd place? Among the current generation, the 360's easily still in first place with worldwide sales. As for Japan...while still a relatively large market for a small landmass, they're not nearly the "make or break" market that they once were. It could easily end up that the 360 takes 1st place in worldwide sales, even though they don't end up #1 in Japan. Although to be honest, the game publishers are only going to be paitent for so long... Blue Dragon already proved that the Japanese ARE willing to buy a 360 given the proper game(s). This could be the opening that Microsoft needs to woo over some of the developers formerly loyal to Sony - like Square Enix. Nintendo, on the other hand, is currently #1 in Japan, and that leverage could help them woo over other developers who depend on the Japanese market for revenue. The problem is, the Wii doesn't have the graphical power that the PS3 or 360 have, which is why I think Square Enix might seriously consider hopping over to the 360 if the PS3 fails to improve. Other developers may be OK with going with the Wii despite it not being the most powerful. > As for Sony with PS4, it depends if PS3 will remain in 3rd place or if it > can gain 2nd place against the 360 which is it up against. The Wii is in a [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > whichever machine has sold more units for greater game sellage which is the > 360 and Wii at this time. The biggest challenge that Sony is going to face with the PS4 is convincing the media, publishers, and consumers, that the PS4 is more than just a bunch of meaningless hot air. A game console with no games is worthless - as Sony and the PS3 have proved. However, as Sega can attest to, scaring off developers on one console is going to make it very hard to bring them back for your next one. If Sony loses too many developers this time around, there may not even BE a PS4 - who would develop for it? The PS3 had huge potential due to the PS2's large marketshare. For that reason alone, I'm sure many developers had made plans for PS3 releases (exclusives or otherwise.) However, with poor sales, any game released for the PS3 will likewise suffer poor sales. This, of course, sets up a nasty feedback loop: poor console sales due to no games scare off developers, which does nothing to alleviate the 'no games' problem. The PS2 had the opposite happen: big sales attracted more developers, who released more games, attacting more sales... > The other thing to keep an eye on is whether if the PS3 ends up selling like > the N64 for being too costly, not enough games support etc, will the 3rd [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > matter how small they were selling in numbers did keep Nintendo in the game. > They can't lose out on money from each console sold. The N64 did OK for itself, as did the GameCube. Nintendo has shown it's perfectly happy to hang back and dominate its niche while letting the others fight over the rest of the market. Unlike the others, Nintendo kept their costs low, and actually managed to sell their hardware for break-even prices, if not for profit. Also, they control the handheld market, so it's not as if they were never making money. > Not that I'm saying that Sony and Microsoft are wrong in selling a machine > and losing money. But I think Sony doesn't have the same mountain of money > that Microsoft has in doing this and that they can't do this for two > generations. I suppose Microsoft next time around could up the specs a lot > more, sell at a loss and hope to go for Sony's throat. I haven't a clue and > it's much too early to discuss about PS4, xbox480/4D? or Wii2 anyways. :) Consoles are always sold at a loss in the begining. Sony loses about $300 for each PS3 they build. Microsoft was losing about $200 on each 360. Nintendo was the oddball, managing to release the Wii for about the same price it costs them to build it. With improvements in manufacturing, all 3 consoles have become cheaper to build. In fact, I've heard the 360 is almost at the break-even point. The real money for console makers comes from the sales of games. They charge the developers a licensing fee for every copy of every game sold. > Me, I buy a PS3 if it had the games which it doesn't at the moment and it if > got down to the ?250 mark. Perhaps releasing the 20gb version in Europe may > have helped some problems of not selling enough units, etc. But I can see a > price cut within 12 months if sales don't rise. Maybe just in time for > Christmas as it will be the true first Xmas year to see which console wins > out on sales. First, Sony has discontinued the 20GB PS3 entirely (well, maybe not in Japan.) You'll never see one. Second, with Sony losing an estimated $250-300 a console(!), I can't see them dropping the price anytime soon. Consoles usually don't see their first price drop until after Christmas anyways, which means the earliest I could conceive the PS3 dropping in price would be 2008. Furthermore, even if the PS3 managed to drop their price a whopping $100, it'd still be $100 more expensive than the 360 Premium, and $20 more expensive than the 360 Elite. Even then, where's the games? The PS3's launch library was a disaster in the US and Japan, with there only one decent - not even "excellent" - exclusive title. I've previously stated that I wouldn't even consider a PS3 until there were at least 6 good (by my standards) games for it. However, the more I think about it, even if there were 6 good games for the PS3, there's no way I'm spending $600 on a game console, and another $360 on a small stack of games. I'm still buying PS2 games, where I think even $30 for an excellent, epic RPG is too much. This is because I *KNOW* prices will drop, so why not wait? As a side note, the 360 passed this threshhold long ago, yet I still don't have one. At first, I told myself I didn't need one because I still have plenty of PS2 games to play, but then I realized that even though I want one, and don't consider $400 too much to spend, there's still that problem of spending $60/game... True, there are budget titles for the 360 now, and a growing used game market. However, I also know that the 360 itself will drop in price, so...why not wait? So long as my backlog holds out, I'm in no rush to buy another console. Heck, $60 could get me as many as 6(!) games with careful shopping. > However, still say Microsoft needs to buy a Japanese developer or two and > make a franchise that will get the 360 selling over there. That's all that > they have lacking at the moment, they do need to sort out whatever problem > they do have in that territory. The 360 has been doing a lot better with regards to Japanese developer support, but still has a long way to go, no doubt. SignatureWin cash and giftcards just for clicking your mouse! http://www.netwinner.com/?signupCode=amuro98 > If the PS3 "flops" (which is way too early to call), that means > they had one bad product following the two most successful consoles in > history. Nintendo also did this. The NES/SNES were (are!) awesome consoles, then the N64 hit... flop. The GCN struggled to make any regains, and then BAM, Wii hits us all for six. So going by that theory, the PS5 should be just wonderful! Shame that wont be for another 20 years (assuming Sony are sticking to their 10-year life span for the PS3) > http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html >snip [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > division. Xbox 360, Wii and their successor will be ruling the > videogame industry. Sony is being ousted. I seriously doubt that. Sony is an electronics manufacturing company, remember? It's never going to be a stretch for them to develop a new console, no matter how poorly the last one did. At the very worst they can take their existing off the shelf technology, put it into a reasonably priced console, and push it via a strong marketing model for publishers and developers, which is pretty much what they did with the original Playstation. The irony here is that of the three companies, Sony easily has the most capability to keep down technology costs for a console, yet they designed the most expensive one of the bunch. If they decide that minimizing hardware losses is the best strategy in the next generation, they'll probably be able to excel at doing so. That will create serious problems for Microsoft if they are still trying to compete head to head with a similar machine. Microsoft has yet to make a dime with the XBox or 360, and in fact they have been losing tremendous amounts of money on the systems. They also have little presence in Japan, so they are unlikely to create an unassailable worldwide market share that will carry them into the next generation. In other words, don't count Sony out yet, in this generation or next. If they can get costs down, the PS3 might be a late bloomer, and they'll be set up pretty well to compete in the next generation. What the hell you going on about, saying Microsoft yet to make a dime with the xbox or 360. They are making a profit now on the 360, a small one maybe. Not like the Sony who are losing $1.7 bill >> http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html >>snip [quoted text clipped - 29 lines] > they can get costs down, the PS3 might be a late bloomer, and they'll be > set up pretty well to compete in the next generation. >What the hell you going on about, saying Microsoft yet to make a dime with >the xbox or 360. They are making a profit now on the 360, a small one maybe. >Not like the Sony who are losing $1.7 bill they've spent something like 20 billion USD and recouped something like 5/6 billion in sales since the launch of the xbox. i'd say that's a loss, wouldn't you? Signaturegamertag: Chrisflynnuk http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk Current eBay auctions: http://tinyurl.com/hutcb 360, DS, PS2 and Saturn Games For Auction. Its costs around $323.30 to make and ship a 20GByte Xbox360 and they sell for around $399.00, so thats a profit of $75.70 for each unit. Where as the PS3 it costs $840.35 to make and ship and sell at around $599.00, thats a massive loss of $241.35 >>What the hell you going on about, saying Microsoft yet to make a dime with >>the xbox or 360. They are making a profit now on the 360, a small one [quoted text clipped - 5 lines] > > i'd say that's a loss, wouldn't you? >Its costs around $323.30 to make and ship a 20GByte Xbox360 and they sell >for around $399.00, so thats a profit of $75.70 for each unit. Where as the >PS3 it costs $840.35 to make and ship and sell at around $599.00, thats a >massive loss of $241.35 doesnt change the fact that they have taken massive losses over the course of their gaming divisions existence. Signaturegamertag: Chrisflynnuk http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk Current eBay auctions: http://tinyurl.com/hutcb 360, DS, PS2 and Saturn Games For Auction. Yeah maybe ya right on that..lol But what does worry me though is that Sony is going deeper into debt every unit they sell or even don't sell. We have 3 PS3 and 2 Xbox 360 in our house and if the game makers pull out of the Sony market because of poor sales I'm stuck with the PS3's >>Its costs around $323.30 to make and ship a 20GByte Xbox360 and they sell >>for around $399.00, so thats a profit of $75.70 for each unit. Where as [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > doesnt change the fact that they have taken massive losses over the > course of their gaming divisions existence. >Yeah maybe ya right on that..lol > >But what does worry me though is that Sony is going deeper into debt every >unit they sell or even don't sell. >We have 3 PS3 and 2 Xbox 360 in our house and if the game makers pull out of >the Sony market because of poor sales I'm stuck with the PS3's why the hell have you got 3 of them? for a bet? Signaturegamertag: Chrisflynnuk http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk Current eBay auctions: http://tinyurl.com/hutcb 360, DS, PS2 and Saturn Games For Auction. lol..no, I've got 5 kids >>Yeah maybe ya right on that..lol >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > for a bet? >lol..no, I've got 5 kids and they can't share? blimey mate, a console each just seems like overkill to me. Signaturegamertag: Chrisflynnuk http://live.xbox.com/member/Chrisflynnuk Current eBay auctions: http://tinyurl.com/hutcb 360, DS, PS2 and Saturn Games For Auction. >>lol..no, I've got 5 kids > >and they can't share? > >blimey mate, a console each just seems like overkill to me. Just cause you are on welfare doesnt mean that he is!!!!! :p > lol..no, I've got 5 kids You're spoiling them rotten. When they grow up and treat you like garbage and have no respect for you at all, I hope you understand that you totally deserve it. Andre >> lol..no, I've got 5 kids > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > > Andre Well you both got that wrong..lol Four of my kids brought their consoles because they work >> lol..no, I've got 5 kids > [quoted text clipped - 3 lines] > >Andre Sounds like you are a card carrying liberal. Telling others what to do with THEIR money!!!! > >You're spoiling them rotten. When they grow up and treat you like garbage > >and have no respect for you at all, I hope you understand that you totally [quoted text clipped - 4 lines] > Sounds like you are a card carrying liberal. Telling others what to do with > THEIR money!!!! Card carrying? Is that an American thing? I'm not sure where you got that information (surely not from Microsoft) but I can't see how it could possibly be correct, considering that Microsoft's EDD division is still losing a lot of money, far too much to be accounted for by their other products. This is especially true when you consider that this is in spite of 360's strong ratio of games sold per console. If you don't believe me, you can check Microsoft's latest financial report for verification, or just look for stories that mention it. Here's one of the telling statements from the latest report: "EDD operating loss decreased during the three months ended March 31, 2007 primarily due to decreased products costs from lower sales of Xbox 360 consoles and increased Mobile and Embedded Devices revenue, partially offset by expenses related to the launch of Zune and increased Xbox 360 console warranty expenses." So, operating loss decreased due to lower sales of the 360? Translation: we lost less money this quarter because we sold fewer consoles. That means they must still be losing money on the console, otherwise the statement above doesn't make much sense. There are also indications in the report, like the statement above, that warranty costs are high. They attribute this to the extension of the warranty to one year, but of course, we all know why they had to extend the warranty to one year in the first place. Even if they were breaking even on hardware costs, they would be losing money on repair and replacements. Microsoft's making a huge amount of money with their Windows monopoly, so I wouldn't worry about them pulling the plug any time soon. That doesn't change the fact that they are still losing significant amounts of money on the 360. I think that they will certainly consider (and reject) the idea of getting out of the business after this generation is over, and that they will also consider (and probably accept) a change to their current business model in the next generation of consoles. > Its costs around $323.30 to make and ship a 20GByte Xbox360 and they sell > for around $399.00, so thats a profit of $75.70 for each unit. Where as [quoted text clipped - 11 lines] >> >> i'd say that's a loss, wouldn't you? > Kutaragi to Work with Sony on PS4, 5, 6 > Although he is moving on, the father of PlayStation will still be > aiding the system's development. I think he could be used in place of a goat as a human sacrifice to help promote a future playstation. > http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html > > Kutaragi to Work with Sony on PS4, 5, 6 > Although he is moving on, the father of PlayStation will still be > aiding the system's development. > by Daemon Hatfield What, wait. What? The guy's 50 now, by the PS4 launch he'll be 60, are they saying he's going to carry on developing consoles until he's 80? Wow, that's dedication. >> http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html >> [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > > Wow, that's dedication. Nah, if the PS3 really does badly, Sony may be pushed for the PS4 in say, 5 years time. SignatureSkipai In alt.games.video.xbox Skipai Otter <skipaiotter@fishbones.hotmail.com> wrote: > Nah, if the PS3 really does badly, Sony may be pushed for the PS4 in say, 5 > years time. Do you think the PS3 will last that long if it does badly? Granted, I don't know if Sony would kill the PS3, and then have nothing on the market for a few years while they scramble to develop the PS4... Sony claims that the PS3 is supposed to have a life cycle of 10 years. We'll see... SignatureWin cash and giftcards just for clicking your mouse! http://www.netwinner.com/?signupCode=amuro98 > In alt.games.video.xbox Skipai Otter > <skipaiotter@fishbones.hotmail.com> wrote: [quoted text clipped - 10 lines] > Sony claims that the PS3 is supposed to have a life cycle of 10 years. > We'll see... Don't know but if you rush the PS4 out, costs are going to be even higher, they may have to do a 5 year stint with the PS3, gives them time to develop the PS4 or decide not to and go back to the old days of making games for other platforms that they did for the Megadrive, 3DO, Phillip CDi and SNES, PC etc. Could get one out if they sold another part of their business to fund etc. However, would they be brave enough to dump the blu-ray drive and make it an addon instead? Doubt it, they gone down a path that has no return. Some gamers wouldn't accept it, even if it would make the next console cheaper. SignatureSkipai > In alt.games.video.xbox Skipai Otter <skipaiotter@fishbones.hotmail.com> > wrote: [quoted text clipped - 7 lines] > Granted, I don't know if Sony would kill the PS3, and then have nothing on > the market for a few years while they scramble to develop the PS4... No way. Sega tried that and it backfired terribly on them. Once gamers, publishers and developers no longer have confidence that you can & will fully support your consoles, it's the end of the line for you as a console manufacturer. > Sony claims that the PS3 is supposed to have a life cycle of 10 years. > We'll see... I don't know that it would be such a bad thing... but it ain't gonna happen. I expect he's laughing too-- all the way to the bank... > http://ps3.ign.com/articles/784/784583p1.html > [quoted text clipped - 81 lines] > division. Xbox 360, Wii and their successor will be ruling the > videogame industry. Sony is being ousted. |
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