http://games.kikizo.com/features/sega_yu_suzuki_iv_feb06_p1.asp

Yu Suzuki: The Kikizo Interview

We spend time with one of gaming's most legendary creators to learn the
latest on Psy-Phi and a great untold story about Suzuki learning
Hakkyokuken from a grand master. Oh, and some Shenmue stuff too.

The highest profile Sega veteran of them all, Yu Suzuki has earned his
elite reputation at the very pinnacle of game creator. One of gaming's
most iconic figures, Suzuki practically invented arcades as we know
them, with hits such as OutRun and After Burner, before pioneering the
modern racing and fighting game genres with Virtua Racing and Virtua
Fighter, and breaking new ground in role playing games with Shenmue.

His career at Sega has spanned some 23 years, and included high points
such as his induction into the Academy of Interactive Arts and
Sciences' Hall of Fame in 2003. He was formerly the president and well
known face of Sega's distinguished AM2 division - proudly characterised
by all of Suzuki's work until around the time he received the
prestigious award and (coincidentally) changed offices at Sega - and
today, operates a completely new division, AM Plus.

Of course Suzuki's role at Sega today is not without its mystery - nor
a degree of debate. Debate, fuelled by his critically acclaimed and
fan-worshipped Shenmue franchise, which has kept players guessing for
some time. Fuelled further, perhaps, by a report on this website last
summer about the future of the project, claiming that internally,
Suzuki is not involved with the elusive and still
officially-unconfirmed next in the core series. And as for mystery,
well, can we just say it's been a while since we've seen a game bearing
the 'YS' seal, and one must surely wonder what Suzuki-san will have for
his fans next.

Kikizo recently spent some time at Sega to meet with Yu Suzuki,
primarily for a much needed, up-to-date, English-language and frankly
very rare interview, focussing on the man himself, his career to date,
and his future goals - but also to see if we could find out any answers
to some clearly burning questions. What we present below, is as
complete a summary on the essential topics as can possibly, humanly be
published. And you can take that or leave it!

Kikizo: Suzuki-san, thanks for your time today. Can you tell us about
your new arcade game, Psy-Phi - what is the setting and the story of
the game, who are the characters?

Yu Suzuki: It's an action-shooting game with 1-on-1 combat, and it's
the first game of its type to use a touch panel control. Everything in
the game is controlled through the touch screen, so the control is more
directly connected with your thoughts and physical actions.

All the characters in the game have psychic capabilities... they're not
robots, they're all humans [capable of] extrasensory perception, if you
will. The costume designs for the characters look very futuristic. Some
characters are even a bit... sexy [laughs]. They're not like characters
I've used in previous games I've done. It's been a challenge for me to
develop them.

Kikizo: When did you first conceptualise Psy-Phi?

YS: A long time ago - I've had an interest in fantasy and sci-fi stuff
since my childhood, when I was watching a lot of anime.

Kikizo: You mean stuff like Mobile Suit Gundam?

YS: A bit older than that. In particular, there was an anime and manga
series called Babel II that really gave me a strong interest in that
sort of thing.

Psy-Phi utilises Suzuki's "newfound pyrokinetic powers"

Kikizo: How long has it been in development?

YS: Planning on the game began about 2 years ago [around the time Mr
Suzuki's 'Digital Rex' studio was first announced].

Kikizo: Why did you choose this touch screen input method over a more
traditional control style? How is it used in gameplay, specifically?

YS: I thought the standard joystick and button layout was getting
rather boring. As I mentioned before, I think you have more direct
control of the characters through the touch screen. It's been a
challenge to implement, but as any good developer will tell you, it's
important to try new things.

Kikizo: Obviously, there's only one console out there that has
touch-screen capabilities... so do you think we'll be seeing anything
Psy-Phi related on the Nintendo DS?

YS: Well, you can call Psy-Phi the Sega DS! [laughs] Actually, we've
joked around about it, but... we haven't considered anything seriously.
I don't think the DS is capable enough. We could make a DS [port of
the] game, but I think it would lose a lot in the transition.

Kikizo: You've always liked to experiment with new gameplay. While some
complained about Shenmue's QTE gameplay feature, they've been proven
wrong by its popularity these days in games like God of War and
Resident Evil 4. Do you strive to create something new for the sake
innovation?

Could Psy-Phi be suited to DS... or Revolution?

YS: There is always a goal set in my mind when I start designing a
game. In order to achieve a new concept, I first have to devise a new
gameplay system. The QTE system emerged from a need to present the
in-game action scenes in a cinematic fashion. I wanted to make the
action a little bit easier than, say, Virtua Fighter. As you know,
timing is very critical in VF. Shenmue is rather the opposite: it gives
the player a bit of extra time to think and react. Even though it's a
"Quick Timer Event," it's not really quick [laughs]. It's easy for the
player to understand and to make choices. You can use any sort of
timing you want.

Kikizo: With that in mind, what are your thoughts on the Nintendo
Revolution controller? Do you think you'd like to make a game that
would take advantage of the system's unique capabilities?

YS: I quite like it. I think the gameplay experience consists of three
different parts: the input device, the gameplay, and the output device.
The input is, of course, the means of control. There's a lot of
interesting means of input, like the recent EyeToy. The gameplay is how
the game program itself responds to and uses the input. The output,
then, is the feedback - audio, visual and so on - and the primary
output device is always a monitor of some sort. The Revolution's focus
is, obviously, the input. It's a new means of controlling the games,
and I think it's an important new development.

Kikizo: We have not seen anything from you on console in a long time.
Can you give us your thoughts on the next-gen consoles, and the new
portable systems, DS and PSP?

YS: They're both nice, and very attractive. It's a pity Sega didn't
make them! [laughs]. The DS is an interesting device, and it's mostly
focused on games for a younger audience. That's very good. The PSP
looks more sleek and stylish, it has a high-quality display, and its
audience is older. That's good too. It's just too bad there aren't any
games for it! From personal experience, I can say that my kids love the
DS. I keep losing to them when we play Puyo Puyo!

As for the consoles, Sony's big point is performance. The CPU, the GPU,
the hardware architecture... Microsoft is about usability, like that of
a PC. Nintendo is focusing on innovation - the new input device, like
we talked about before. I think it's good for the player, since it
gives them a lot of options. It wouldn't be interesting if all of the
console manufacturers were headed in the same direction.

Kikizo: What are your thoughts on the current arcade market?

YS: The arcade market is declining a bit. A few big companies like
Capcom have scaled down development considerably. As a result, we're
the strongest in the business now. That's certainly good for Sega. So
even though the overall market is shrinking, we're still making a
killing. We've got a sixty per cent market share in Japan now, so it's
not bad at all for us. Even though the overall market is shrinking, we
don't have any real enemies. That's not so bad, is it? [laughs]. Since
it is shrinking, though, we've really got to focus on bringing new
things to market. No more rapid-fire series of 2 or 3...

Kikizo: There seems to be a trend of nostalgia in the industry at the
moment. Two of your most popular games, After Burner and OutRun are
popular again and older titles like Space Harrier and Virtua Racing
have been re-released. Some say that the increased popularity of
old-fashioned games is because modern games have become too
complicated. What are your thoughts on this?

YS: It's a matter of personal preference. Some people find tough games
to be exciting. Some people like easy games. There have to be both in
the market, so that there's something for everyone. Personally, I'd
like to have more easy-to-play games.

The decline is because all the machines are in receptions

Kikizo: The arcade business in the west has been in constant decline.
What part can game developers play when it comes to reversing the
slump?

YS: We - or another company, perhaps - need to succeed in introducing
new concepts. After that has been accomplished, other people can hop on
the bandwagon, so to speak. Let's think of arcade machine investments
as something like a piggy bank. The operators are able to count a
machine's earnings, so they can easily see if bank A is earning more
than bank B. Smaller arcades operate much like this.

In Japan, Sega's arcade management operations started with smaller
arcades, then moved up to Sega Worlds in various cities and suburbs,
and finally culminated in Tokyo Joypolis. So, I think we also need to
move towards the concept of large, more general entertainment centers,
with live entertainment and food and such... like Joypolis here in
Japan and Gameworks in the US. Kind of like an entertainment shopping
mall or supermarket, you know? It should be an unusual, special place
in people's minds.

There are a lot of emerging markets where it's easy to expand. You need
a disposable income to enjoy games. Korea, Taiwan, China, and India are
emerging markets for our arcade games, but the disposable income isn't
so high yet. We are especially busy with the market in China, in
particular. As entertainment, arcade games won't vanish. But we'll have
more options.

Kikizo: Not too long ago, arcade hardware was much more advanced than
home console systems. Today, they are almost equal. To what extent are
console games a threat to arcades, and what can arcades offer a player
that home games can't?

YS: Yes, definitely [a threat]. But one thing that console games can't
do is to gather a large group of spectators to watch you play. They
also don't provide any large, specialized cabinets. Even if a console
game does provide specialized controls, they're usually too expensive
for the average consumer. But what I really think the continuing
popularity of arcades will hinge on is "live entertainment" and real
human relationships. Currently this is a weak point for most arcades.

Kikizo: What can Japanese developers do to combat the shrinking
Japanese videogame market?

YS: I think Western makers are more likely to try new things, and are
more aggressive. The Japanese companies are more conservative, and they
rely too much on "safety" series, and sequels. They don't challenge
themselves and the industry with new ideas. You can't make a new market
out of that. People overseas seem to put more passion into making games
that they want to, rather than games that will strictly sell. That is a
big risk, but as the saying goes, no risk, no return. If you're in a
desert, alone, you have to keep moving to look for water, you can't
just sit there and wait to be rescued! Right now, we're going into the
Chinese market. Maybe we'll be stronger there.

Kikizo: How do you think the rising cost of videogame development will
affect Sega as a company and the videogame industry as a whole?

YS: Cost performance is a very important thing for a developer to keep
in mind. You need good tools to help develop the games while keeping
the cost down. Kind of like a "weapon," or something. We'll probably be
doing a lot more outsourcing as well.

Kikizo: How is Sega different these days from the time when you started
working here? Are you happy with how things have progressed? Do you
miss the past, or are you more focused on the future?

YS: Yes, things are very different now! I do long for the past
sometimes, but right now, I have TONS of stuff I need to do. I can't
waste time on reflection. I'm focusing on the future, not the past. So
I'd say that right now, my thought process is ninety per cent future
and ten per cent past!

Kikizo: Let's talk about Shenmue. Can you tell us anything about
Shenmue Online - where will the story of the game proceed from where it
left off in Shenmue 2? How will Shenmue Online fit into the core
series?

YS: Shenmue Online is still in development. I'm working hard on it -
real busy! It's an MMO game for PCs. The original Shenmue had combat,
so I'm hoping to focus more on the battle scenes. We also had a lot of
events and minigames, which will carry over to Shenmue Online.

Remember how some of my old arcade games were in the previous Shenmue
games? They'll be here, too. The player will be able to follow the
Shenmue story through the game. It's not based on any existing Shenmue
title. There are a lot of features in Shenmue that carry over well into
an MMO game.

MMOs have a community aspect, with guilds, fighting, trading, etc.
Shenmue has a lot of these features already. The area to explore is
also much bigger than previous games. Like in the original game, you
can learn many fighting techniques while you play.

Kikizo: In the event Shenmue was never finished, would the possibility
exist for the story to be finished trough other media, like DVD or
books?

YS: No, the story will be finished through games. The MMO will be a
game that will have a long lifespan through upgrades and updates. This
will allow gradual continuation to the story. It follows up directly to
the story of Shenmue 2 at first, but maybe we'll move on even further
as time passes.

Kikizo: As for your own work, which projects are your personal
favourites?

YS: That's hard to say. Shenmue will be a project that I feel very
close to. It's not just a memory; it exists as a part of me. Ferrari
355 is another one that I really enjoyed. I went to Italy, met the
Ferrari guys, drove around in Ferarri's circuit, and ate at a famous
restaurant - it was great!

Kikizo: Actually several Sega staff have Ferraris and you especially
are clearly fond of them. What is it about Ferraris you enjoy so much,
and why are they so popular at Sega?

YS: Yeah, I wonder... I have no idea what those guys think, but
Nagoshi, as a former designer, probably likes the design aspect. I know
Nagoshi has bought a Ferrari, but I have yet to see him drive it! Naka
is a big race fan, so he is more of a fan of the technical side of the
cars. Actually, uh... I really prefer bikes. Ferarri is the car most
like a bike, I think. It's a 4-wheeled motorcycle!

Kikizo: Virtua Fighter and F355 are pretty realistic simulations, is
realism one of the main goals in your games?

YS: Reality is not really a goal of mine, no. Reality in the context of
games is nonsense. If it's completely realistic, then what's the point?
What's so entertaining about the usual and the mundane bits of life?
What is more important is believability within the game itself. After
all, being completely unusual isn't good, either. You need a fine
balance, somewhere in the middle. But I like fantasy, too.

Kikizo: Do you still play games regularly at all? What are your
preferred titles and genres?

YS: No, not regularly. I actually don't play games very much, and
haven't done so for quite a while. I really just play easy games with
my kids. I think my gaming life these days consists entirely of air
hockey, Whac-a-mole, and Puyo Puyo. Those are my three big titles!
[laughs] I do all kinds of genres - fighting, driving, shooting - and I
don't prefer any one in particular...Well, okay, I don't like scary
games. That's about it!

Kikizo: Is there a special game you would like to have developed?

YS: Hmm, I don't really have that feeling. Well actually, there is a
Harry Potter game that involves the characters playing a 5-on-5
dodgeball-like game while riding brooms in the air. I had a concept for
it for a while, but then Harry Potter came along and stole it from
right under me! [laughs]

Kikizo: What sort of direction do you see gaming in general headed
towards in the future?

YS: I have no idea... I think that perhaps control interfaces will
become more direct, with no hardware. Maybe eventually you will be able
to control games with your brain waves, and chips in your body. Some of
these are already used to mark dolphins and such. Some children born
with weak hearts have a sensor implanted in them. In the future, you
might not even need any passports! Back when I was born, I couldn't
even imagine the sort of things we have today. Now we have all kinds of
technology. I couldn't believe that this sort of world could exist. One
of the greatest frustrations in making games is the desire of wanting
to do something, but we aren't able to do it due to technical
limitations. Right now, what you need to do well in games is judgement
in skill, but in the future, it will probably just rely upon judgement.

Kikizo: Could you share with us a unique or weird experience
encountered during your career?

YS: There have been so, so many. Well, here's one: When we were doing
Virtua Fighter, I went to a Chinese Kenpo temple to do research. There
was a grand master there. The first thing we did was drink. It's a
white liquor, a local speciality. The Chinese custom is that you must
drink 3 shots in a row for all the people that you meet. There were
eight people there. Three times eight is 24. That's quite a lot.

You show that the cup is empty by turning it upside down. You don't
want to upset anyone, so you do that. The grand master was impressed,
and said that all the Japanese he had met before just drank beer. You
had been the only one who has drank such heavy liquor, he said!
[laughs] After that, he taught me some Hakkyokuken techniques... [the
art used by Akira Yuki in the game] though at this point, it was
looking more like drunken fist! Since he's a grand master, he'll stop
his fist before it hits you. But, since he was drunk, I wound up
getting gut-punched. I went down head first, onto the hard stone floor.
The scar on my head left from that was actually the second! I got one
in junior high before that - in Shorinji, I had something similar
happen. Except it wasn't the grand master that time, but one of his
students!

Kikizo: What can we expect from Suzuki-san in the future?

YS: Please don't expect so much! I don't need the pressure! [laughs].
Well, I'd like to take on new challenges in the future... with my
newfound pyrokinetic powers!

But I'm not concerned about particular genres or platform. This
department is called AM Plus, which means it's not strictly arcade
development... its roots are in arcades, but we are planning big things
all around. I hope Psy-Phi will hit US and European markets soon, so I
can get to working on more new games with new ideas.

Kikizo: Good luck on your projects at Sega, and thanks again for this
interview.

While other high profile creators like Tetsuya Mizuguchi and Rikiya
Nakagawa have long since left 'New Sega', Yu Suzuki remains. While the
likes of Yuji Naka, Toshihiro Nagoshi and Hiroshi Kataoka have held
fairly consistent, increasingly authoritative roles at Sega, Suzuki's
intriguing movement at the company appears to have settled on an a
potent, purely content-focussed role.

With projects openly announced and a broad outlook for the future, AM
Plus seems to indicate that Yu Suzuki could be back in a driving seat
of sorts - which is excellent news. In the past Suzuki has been held
back from discussing old issues, but now it seems he has his own game
plan for new things altogether.

We should clear up that there was one detail in the article last summer
that we were mistaken about, which was the digression that Shenmue
Online had been canned, based on then-recent reports to that effect,
citing the apparent loss of interest in the project from its South
Korean developer, JC Entertainment. Now of course, it's clear that the
project is active.

Officially Sega will not talk about a real Shenmue successor under any
circumstances. Some stuff we've agreed with Sega can't be published,
although there was nothing of massive significance to provide an
absolute answer that some fans want - and we're not just being
tantalising for the sake of it here, the point is that Sega really,
really doesn't like talking about Shenmue at all.

But based on everything we know to be true at this moment in time - and
aside from detail that has since changed - all of it was accurate.
Which as we stressed heavily at the time, doesn't necessarily mean
Shenmue 3 will come out, but it would be very foolish to write it off.
Despite some presumptions made based on (at best) questionable
translation of an interview in November, Yu Suzuki has NEVER said there
would be no Shenmue 3. And as he puts it to us: "the story will be
finished through games".

It was a pleasure meeting with Suzuki-san again so he could share his
thoughts with us.

Kikizo Staff